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Author Topic: "New" vs. "Old" 870 Police  (Read 6018 times)

tactical22

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"New" vs. "Old" 870 Police
« on: April 28, 2012, 11:22:25 am »
I have heard that somewhere along the line, Remington switched the trigger guard from solid aluminum to "powdered metal" or some such.  Is this true?  Also, I have heard that there was a change in the action that altered the shooters ability to pump as soon after the trigger is pulled.  Also true?  Anybody know approximately when these, or other changes were made, if they were made at all?  How can I tell the difference?
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    Coronach

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    Re: "New" vs. "Old" 870 Police
    « Reply #1 on: April 28, 2012, 03:44:15 pm »
    The trigger guard has indeed been altered. I don't count that as being a big deal. Yeah, sure, it would be nice if they hadn't changed it, but in the grand scheme of things switching the trigger guard material is a non-issue. It's not like even the newer/cheaper ones break.

    More of an issue would be MIM (metal injection molded, essentially the powdered metal you mentioned) used in some of the small parts. I'd have to look at my armorer's DVD to see what was changed and when. Since my class was armorer's level for PDs, the trigger/hammer assembly was basically treated as a unit. If something in it screws up, consider replacing the whole assembly, since it is easier and probably not a bad idea, since of one thing went Tango Uniform, the other small parts in the FCG may be worn as well. We went over working on the assemblies, but we didn't go into much detail about what was changed when.

    Really, though, it is hard to screw up an 870. Even Remington can make them.

    Mike
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    Coronach

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    Re: "New" vs. "Old" 870 Police
    « Reply #2 on: April 28, 2012, 03:46:30 pm »
    Oh, and I have not heard about anything delaying the pump-to-trigger pull time. The way the gun operates has not been changed. Materials and some assembly details have changed, but its function is not altered, AFAIK.

    Mike
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    coelacanth

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    Re: "New" vs. "Old" 870 Police
    « Reply #3 on: April 29, 2012, 03:36:49 am »
    And then there is the difference between the police version and the civilian, bird hunter version.
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    Coronach

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    Re: "New" vs. "Old" 870 Police
    « Reply #4 on: April 29, 2012, 08:32:57 am »
    Dimples. I hate the dimples.

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    steveracer

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    Re: "New" vs. "Old" 870 Police
    « Reply #5 on: April 29, 2012, 12:09:51 pm »
    The older one was virtually identical to the Wingmaster for finish and fit. The newer ones are still pretty good, of course.
    Honestly, unless you are a stickler for finish, the old verses new thing is a wash.

    tactical22

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    Re: "New" vs. "Old" 870 Police
    « Reply #6 on: April 29, 2012, 01:14:47 pm »
    I've heard about the pump-to-trigger pull time delay from several sources, but this is the first one I could find:

    Quote
    In my opinion, the older 870s are some of the best. On those you could actually touch the trigger and pull to the rear on the pump at the exact same time, allowing you to place pressure to the rear on the pump. You could pull the trigger, collapse the gun, and cycle the gun a little bit faster. The newer 870s don’t allow you to do that. On the new 870s you have to be more limber on the pump, pull the trigger, and then cycle the gun really fast; if you don’t, you lock the breach up.

    http://www.rem870.com/2012/04/27/full-interview-with-chris-costa/
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    RMc

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    Re: "New" vs. "Old" 870 Police
    « Reply #7 on: April 29, 2012, 11:02:14 pm »
    I can see how a well used 870 may have a smoother release of the inertia slide lock. However, the slide lock releases in recoil so most shooters would never notice it even existed.
    -----------------------------------------
    From an earlier post:

    Inertia slide lock?

    If you hold the forearm tightly to the rear and dry-fire a Remington 870 or Mossberg 500, the action will remain locked. That is the forearm or slide handle must move forward slightly, as in recoil, to allow the action to unlock. This was to avoid an open action in the event of a hang-fire. This was part of the slide action genre going back to the Winchester 1893.

    By the 1964 introduction of the 1200 Winchester (later 1300 and "Speed Pump"), primers had become so reliable that hangfires were virtually unheard of. Thus the slight delay in unlocking the rotary bolt of the 1200 was considered sufficient. So if you hold the forearm of a Model 1200/1300 tightly to the rear and dry-fire, the action will virtually fly open. Hence the term "Speed Pump." In essence it is a recoil assisted slide action.

    Alabama

    Coronach

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    Re: "New" vs. "Old" 870 Police
    « Reply #8 on: April 29, 2012, 11:08:47 pm »
    yeah, that's going to be a difference in theory as opposed to in practice. It may be noticable in dry fire practice (I'll have to get my old Wingmaster out and compare it to my newer offerings to see), but not when you're actually shooting.

    next time I'm out I'll have to see if I can replicate what Costa is talking about. I maintain pretty steady pressure on the forearm when shooting and I've never had it hang up on me. My usual gun is an 870 Express with the dreaded dremelled dimples, so while it is not new new, it's pretty recent.

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    RMc

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    Re: "New" vs. "Old" 870 Police
    « Reply #9 on: April 29, 2012, 11:09:18 pm »
    I've heard about the pump-to-trigger pull time delay from several sources, but this is the first one I could find:

    http://www.rem870.com/2012/04/27/full-interview-with-chris-costa/

    "  Center gun into your chest  -  stretch...fire...collapse...cycle...stretch...fire...   "
       
    Chris Costa uses some unusual terminology to describe mounting and operating a pump gun!
    Alabama

    tactical22

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    Re: "New" vs. "Old" 870 Police
    « Reply #10 on: April 29, 2012, 11:36:07 pm »
    Yeah, his syntax in general does occasionally leave something to be desired.  He knows his stuff though, and seems like he would be a really nice guy.
    _________
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    "No King But Jesus!"

    "...That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of th

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