Weapons and Gear => Rifles => Topic started by: Plebian on May 14, 2020, 04:53:44 pm

Title: Enfield No.4 Mk1 value
Post by: Plebian on May 14, 2020, 04:53:44 pm
Anyone know the approx value of a surplus Enfield no.4 Mk1. They are in typical surplus shape; stocks dented and scratched a bit but not cracked or severely damaged, barrel still have strong rifling but bore is dark, metal is good with no pitting or severe rust just light dust, magazines intact and functional.

Title: Re: Enfield No.4 Mk1 value
Post by: ksuguy on May 14, 2020, 05:39:17 pm
Classic Firearms is selling them for $400.

Title: Re: Enfield No.4 Mk1 value
Post by: coelacanth on May 16, 2020, 01:26:59 pm
A few questions, if i may.   

1) How does the bolt face look and is there a number stamped on the removable bolt head unit?  2) Does the rifle's safety function as designed?  3) Is the muzzle crown undamaged?   4) Is the rear sight unit tight and functional? 

In my experience these things have considerable variability among surplus rifles and all affect the performance of the rifle(s) when fired so it is good to establish a baseline in terms of its condition in addition to the information you have already provided.  Some of the rifles have served for a long time in various places since they were reconditioned and surplussed by the British after they adopted the FN/FAL . Some of that service was in the hands of conscripts under harsh conditions.   The ones that have survived are more a testament to the basic soundness of the rifle's design and execution rather than the skill of third world troops and armorers.

This site:  www.gunsinternationl.com   has an alphabetical index page and the first column on the left has "Enfield Rifles" about halfway down.

It currently has 55 rifles listed and several are the No.4 Mk I .  There are photos of the rifles as well as descriptions and prices - all of which should help you determine both where your rifle falls when compared to the ones shown as well as what the price range is currently. 

Its been a while since I was at a gun show but the last time I went the old Enfields were kind of scarce.  There were a couple of nice examples but most were average to rough condition.   The nice ones were priced high - from $750 to about $900 and one guy was trying to pass off an otherwise nice rifle as a "T" model sniper for $1200.  I pointed out the obvious discrepancies and was told, " If all you're going to do is put fingerprints on the merchandise and bad-mouth it, just move on. " .  Before moving on I asked the guy if he was that stupid or if he just thought the rest of us were.  I got a dirty look so I grinned at him, shook my head and sauntered to the next table.    :cool  The average to rough condition rifles were priced from $450 - $600.  Pretty optimistic in some cases but informative.  I probably counted 20 - 25 rifles at most scattered among 100+ tables and displays.   

Local shops have a few rifles on display but, again, the availability is not what it was ten years ago.  Condition ranges from fair to very good for a few examples and prices are running from about $400 for the fair ones to $700 for one in very good condition.  There were at least three or four rifles in the fair to good range for every one in very good condition.   

Hope this helps.   :coffee

Title: Re: Enfield No.4 Mk1 value
Post by: ksuguy on May 17, 2020, 01:13:00 pm
Unfortunately a lot of Enfields passed through third world countries where maintenance was not all that great.   For instance, I think a lot of the ones from Classic Firearms came from Ethiopia.  Forgotten Weapons has been featuring guns from that recent batch of imports recently since there was a wide variety of many different types of firearms and unusual variants.  It seems like almost every one he's talked about has been beat to s___ and rusty.

During one of the videos he showed some footage of where Interordnance found them.   There were just pallets of stuff sitting in non climate controlled metal sheds out in a field somewhere.  They've probably been there for decades.    I'm guessing there might be a few decent ones out of the thousands they brought in,  but that is going to be the exception.   
Title: Re: Enfield No.4 Mk1 value
Post by: coelacanth on May 18, 2020, 12:51:40 pm
Agreed.  That has been the case in most "third world" countries for decades.  The best you can hope for is to find one where the Cosmolene was applied liberally and is still intact and hope it wasn't handled so roughly that something got bent or broken.  I have a couple of Enfields from some of the first that were surplussed out in the 1950's - 1960's and they are what would be considered very good condition today.  Nice shooters, all parts within spec and not beat all to hell and gone.  My oldest example is a BSA No.1 Mk III from 1917 and the old girl still thumps them in there ( minute of five gallon bucket target ) out to 400 yards or so in the informal desert range shooting we typically do. 

As you say, buying one in today's market makes knowing what you're doing pretty important.  Wall hangers are nice but when buying a milsurp rifle to actually shoot you have to sweat the details.   Just because something has the "FTR" mark from way back doesn't mean it was treated well in the interim and if you don't have the knowledge base and the inspection tools to determine actual condition on the spot you can easily make an expensive mistake.

Don't forget that the importers and distributors get first pick of the nicest ones and even the guys at the local gun shop get a crack at what's left to go on the used rifle racks.  It doesn't mean you can't still find what you're looking for but it has gotten more difficult of late.
Title: Re: Enfield No.4 Mk1 value
Post by: ksuguy on May 19, 2020, 11:47:32 am
Yeah, I like old military surplus rifles, but I don't want to pay double what a modern gun would cost for a rusty example.