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Author Topic: This is my jam.  (Read 177874 times)

MTK20

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Re: This is my jam.
« Reply #775 on: June 10, 2019, 05:51:49 pm »
https://www.theroot.com/youtube-to-remove-thousands-of-channels-ban-hate-speec-1835272306

 :shrug

Maybe yours just weren't bad enough? I dunno...

Apparently, two of the effected were Louis Farrakhan & Alex Jones...

I'll have to dig deeper. My feelings would be hurt if I wasn't irreverent or offensive enough to garner some kind of PC outrage  :neener .
Texas
Do we forget that cops were primarily still using 6 Shot Revolvers well through the mid 80's? It wasn't until after 1986 that most departments then relented and went to autos.
Capacity wasn't really an issue then... and honestly really it's not even an issue now.
Ray Chapman, used to say that the 125-grain Magnum load’s almost magical stopping power was the only reason to load .357 instead of .38 Special +P ammunition into a fighting revolver chambered for the Magnum round. I agree. - Massad Ayoob

Paradoxically it is those who strive for self-reliance, who remain vigilant and ready to help others.

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    coelacanth

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    Re: This is my jam.
    « Reply #776 on: June 10, 2019, 06:44:26 pm »
    They took down a bunch of far-right channels, for hate speech transgressions.
    Not.  :scrutiny  Get up to speed/get your facts straight.  They demonetized contributors they have political differences with because contributors they agree with whined and pi&&ed and moaned about the unfairness of it all.  That unfairness being free speech and the right to express a different opinion in a manner consistent with posted content policies of the YouTube platform.  They couldn't even cite any actual example of an infraction of those posted "rules" - they just said you can't make any money here.  Typical unethical double standard bulls&*t we've come to expect from the Marxist/leftist/statist end of the political spectrum. 

    https://www.dailywire.com/news/48210/goggle-ceo-youtube-will-begin-targeting-content-james-barrett

    https://www.theblaze.com/news/google-ceo-crackdown-on-controversial-content

    Arizona" A republic, if you can keep it."

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    coelacanth

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    Re: This is my jam.
    « Reply #777 on: June 10, 2019, 06:52:08 pm »
    Steven Crowder's  "Louder With Crowder" videos have become the canary in the coal mine for the latest authoritarian measures by the social media giant(s).  If you can't beat them in the arena of ideas - cheat.  The end justifies the means for this mob - just as it always does.  Situational ethics is a wonderful concept.  It allows the user so MUCH flexibility.  Truth and logic and reason - deployed against it must be stamped out immediately - because, "HATE SPEECH!".    :coffee

    I'm startin' to cop an attitude here.   :scrutiny
    Arizona" A republic, if you can keep it."

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    MTK20

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    Re: This is my jam.
    « Reply #778 on: June 10, 2019, 07:19:40 pm »
    I hadn't noticed that louder with Crowder had taken fire. That is unfortunate.
    Texas
    Do we forget that cops were primarily still using 6 Shot Revolvers well through the mid 80's? It wasn't until after 1986 that most departments then relented and went to autos.
    Capacity wasn't really an issue then... and honestly really it's not even an issue now.
    Ray Chapman, used to say that the 125-grain Magnum load’s almost magical stopping power was the only reason to load .357 instead of .38 Special +P ammunition into a fighting revolver chambered for the Magnum round. I agree. - Massad Ayoob

    Paradoxically it is those who strive for self-reliance, who remain vigilant and ready to help others.

    coelacanth

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    Re: This is my jam.
    « Reply #779 on: June 10, 2019, 07:29:51 pm »
    While accurate, your characterization of the situation is understatement at its finest.   Something on the order of noting that Secretariat won the 1973 Kentucky Derby.   :coffee
    Arizona" A republic, if you can keep it."

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    booksmart

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    Re: This is my jam.
    « Reply #780 on: June 11, 2019, 09:28:22 am »
    I don't think I'd count The Blaze and The Daily Wire as "non-partial sources".

    The article I cited noted Louis Farrakhan and Alex Jones as both being sent off... seems even handed to me.

    coelacanth

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    Re: This is my jam.
    « Reply #781 on: June 11, 2019, 01:57:37 pm »
    Of course it does.   :coffee    Who claimed impartiality?  On any side of this issue?  What sources have you referred to that could reasonably be considered "non-partial sources."?   :scrutiny    Partial or not, the truth is the truth and YouTube expressly said Mr. Crowder had not violated any of the terms of use.  Then they caught hell from the radical, militant wing of the left, caved in to that pressure and "de-monetized" Mr. Crowder on the YouTube service.  Your reference to Farrakhan and Jones is a month or two behind the curve in terms of relevance to what we were discussing and the action smacks of "tokenism", if I may borrow a word from the left.  Even the most casual investigation of Farrakhan reveals the ugly truth there and it has been flaunted for decades on any and every media outlet you can name - without consequence - until his words and actions became so egregious that even the left thought it an opportune time to throw him under the bus. 

    Don't even pretend this is ethical and even-handed treatment of the situation and the parties involved here.    :coffee

    "I won't insult your intelligence by suggesting you really believe what you just said."     William F. Buckley, Jr.

    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views."   
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    Arizona" A republic, if you can keep it."

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    booksmart

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    Re: This is my jam.
    « Reply #782 on: June 11, 2019, 04:49:35 pm »
    I think it's really funny you're getting bent out of shape over this.

    It's not like they're being asked to bake a cake or anything. They're just being asked to be the platform by which people broadcast views they disagree with.

    So, do businesses have the right to withhold services from someone based on their political views or not?

    MTK20

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    Re: This is my jam.
    « Reply #783 on: June 11, 2019, 04:57:45 pm »
    The part that bothers me about this is that I'm not happy with YouTube for censoring, because I won't get to hear as many varied opinions (and YouTube is definitely my "new media" news source). Yet if I boycott YouTube, then I'm just cutting myself off from remaining obscure viewpoints that I wish to hear.

    YouTube has a monopoly in this area of the internet. There's not really any competition for them.
    Texas
    Do we forget that cops were primarily still using 6 Shot Revolvers well through the mid 80's? It wasn't until after 1986 that most departments then relented and went to autos.
    Capacity wasn't really an issue then... and honestly really it's not even an issue now.
    Ray Chapman, used to say that the 125-grain Magnum load’s almost magical stopping power was the only reason to load .357 instead of .38 Special +P ammunition into a fighting revolver chambered for the Magnum round. I agree. - Massad Ayoob

    Paradoxically it is those who strive for self-reliance, who remain vigilant and ready to help others.

    booksmart

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    Re: This is my jam.
    « Reply #784 on: June 11, 2019, 05:39:51 pm »
    A quick googling tells me there are several other platforms via which someone can stream video, if they want to get their message out.

    YouTube is not the only game in town.

    booksmart

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    Re: This is my jam.
    « Reply #785 on: June 11, 2019, 05:46:02 pm »
    Is this what you're referring to?

    Quote
    The tension was evident on Tuesday, when YouTube said a prominent right-wing creator who used racial language and homophobic slurs to harass a journalist in videos on YouTube did not violate its policies. The decision set off a firestorm online, including accusations that YouTube was giving a free pass to some of its popular creators.

    From : https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/05/business/youtube-remove-extremist-videos.html

    Yeah, I'm sorry, but if the description is accurate, and he's using racist language and homophobic slurs to harass somebody? Fluff him.

    To put it bluntly, that's not "sharing views".  You can share contrasting ideas and be civil. ^That^ ain't how you do it.

    Plebian

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    Re: This is my jam.
    « Reply #786 on: June 11, 2019, 06:25:49 pm »
    Is this what you're referring to?

    From : https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/05/business/youtube-remove-extremist-videos.html

    Yeah, I'm sorry, but if the description is accurate, and he's using racist language and homophobic slurs to harass somebody? Fluff him.

    To put it bluntly, that's not "sharing views".  You can share contrasting ideas and be civil. ^That^ ain't how you do it.

    Youtube shared in their statement that Crowder did not harass Maza. That is why they 'only' demonetized his entire channel.

    Crowder simply referred to the fellow in the same manner in which he referred to himself. The video was about debunking Maza's line of reasoning. Crowder has always been completely civil, and he was simply adding some comedic flair. It was not nearly as bad as most late night hosts get away with nightly on mainstream TV.

    Maza is the only individual that has called for his followers to actively flag Crowder and to throw milkshakes at conservative speakers. Crowder has stated over and over for people to not harass or dox anyone.

    Crowder's 'horrible' offenses has been referring to him as 'the queer mexican on Vox' and 'the gay anchor baby on Vox'. Which was only used AFTER Maza used those descriptors of himself. Maza's twitter is @gaywonk. So the fellow is putting this front and center himself.

    Also Crowder has done these videos since 2014 debunking this fellow with the same 'horrible' offenses. It is only now that the fellow gets upset? Seems some odd timing to me, especially considering the turmoil Vox is encountering with its workers right now(strike going on and whatnot with significant layoffs due to failing channels.)

    Crowder is running a show the same as any late night host on TV.

    If you do not have the right to offend. Then you do not have the right to free speech. This is doubly true for comedy.     
    Oklahoma"If all our problems are solved, we'll find new ones to replace them. If we can't find new ones, we'll make new ones."

    Plebian

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    Re: This is my jam.
    « Reply #787 on: June 11, 2019, 06:55:36 pm »
    My main issue is with Youtube only applying these terms to conservatives and not progressives. Maza has called on his followers to flag all of Crowder's videos. Which is stated as against Youtube's TOS, but Maza has not been demonetized or even asked to stop.

    I truly hope this gets pushed into the courts. Hopefully they can finally decide if Youtube etc is a platform or a publisher. They were given special privileges under Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act. They were only chosen to get protections from lawsuits for what they publish if they are 'forums for a true diversity of political discourse.' They are meant to be open channels of communication not curators of acceptable opinion.

    Almost all the social media sites have been using both sides of the platform and publisher protections. If these companies are going to be making editorial decisions (which is what this is). Then they are publishers with the full liability of their presented content.

    Google has argued that restricting its right to censor would 'impose liability on YouTube as a publisher.' While also holding that its right to restrict political content is its “First Amendment protection for a publisher’s editorial judgments,” which “encompasses the choice of how to present, or even whether to present, particular content.”

    They cannot be both. There needs to be a decision made one way or the other.
    Oklahoma"If all our problems are solved, we'll find new ones to replace them. If we can't find new ones, we'll make new ones."

    coelacanth

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    Re: This is my jam.
    « Reply #788 on: June 11, 2019, 09:05:16 pm »
    Regarding the last two posts:  " Game, set and match."   Well said. 

    Arizona" A republic, if you can keep it."

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    coelacanth

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    Re: This is my jam.
    « Reply #789 on: June 11, 2019, 09:18:49 pm »
    Is this what you're referring to?

    From : https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/05/business/youtube-remove-extremist-videos.html

    Yeah, I'm sorry, but if the description is accurate, and he's using racist language and homophobic slurs to harass somebody? Fluff him.

    To put it bluntly, that's not "sharing views".  You can share contrasting ideas and be civil. ^That^ ain't how you do it.
    Wait .  .  .  are you presenting us the New York Times as a " . . . non-partial source." ?  .  .  .   :rotfl

    And for the record, if you haven't seen the material in question - from both sides - what right do you have to decide "Fluff him." on either side of it?  Unless you're comfortable letting a staff writer or editorialist from the New York Times do all your thinking for you.   :hmm    Seems to me you're getting bent out of shape by a situation you're not even familiar with, no?    :coffee

    To put it bluntly, let me know when the militant LGBTQRSTUVWXYZ lobby decides to be "civil" when they want to ". . .share contrasting ideas . . .".   
    Arizona" A republic, if you can keep it."

                                                   Benjamin Franklin

    coelacanth

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    Re: This is my jam.
    « Reply #790 on: June 11, 2019, 09:22:41 pm »
    A quick googling tells me there are several other platforms via which someone can stream video, if they want to get their message out.

    YouTube is not the only game in town.
    Why yes, yes there are.   So why not let the @gaywonk go use it and leave the guy with an order of magnitude more followers alone - especially since he hasn't committed any TOS infraction.  Seems to me that "go somewhere else" idea works both ways, no?   :coffee
    Arizona" A republic, if you can keep it."

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    coelacanth

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    Re: This is my jam.
    « Reply #791 on: June 11, 2019, 09:38:01 pm »
    I think it's really funny you're getting bent out of shape over this.

    It's not like they're being asked to bake a cake or anything. They're just being asked to be the platform by which people broadcast views they disagree with.

    So, do businesses have the right to withhold services from someone based on their political views or not?
    Glad you're being entertained.  If I were truly "getting bent out of shape over this.", you'd know it.  Irritated?  Yup.  You?    :coffee

    As for your question, I don't know - do they?   Seems to me the SCOTUS decided a person's religious beliefs and the business practices they dictate cannot be trivialized by the state even when a pernicious attack by persons holding different beliefs is mounted in the legal system. 


    Arizona" A republic, if you can keep it."

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    coelacanth

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    Re: This is my jam.
    « Reply #792 on: June 11, 2019, 11:05:56 pm »
    Since you brought it up,  here's an interesting update and commentary.

    https://pjmedia.com/trending/christian-baker-jack-phillips-is-being-sued-again/

    Or this if PJMedia is somehow too skewed to be credible to you.   :coffee

    https://www.newsweek.com/colorado-baker-protagonist-satan-dildo-cake-other-bakeries-wouldnt-create-1077250

    Or this if it is more palatable to your "libertarian" leanings.    :coffee

    https://thefederalist.com/2019/06/10/supreme-court-acts-christians-will-punished-thought-crimes/

    « Last Edit: June 11, 2019, 11:25:15 pm by coelacanth »
    Arizona" A republic, if you can keep it."

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    booksmart

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    Re: This is my jam.
    « Reply #793 on: June 12, 2019, 09:53:14 am »

    Crowder simply referred to the fellow in the same manner in which he referred to himself. The video was about debunking Maza's line of reasoning. Crowder has always been completely civil, and he was simply adding some comedic flair. It was not nearly as bad as most late night hosts get away with nightly on mainstream TV.


    If you stop to think about it, any member of a minority (whatever it is) will tell you that there is a world of difference between a pejorative term coming from either oneself or someone within your minority, and someone from outside your group using the same pejorative.  Hence, the reason black folks are fine with calling each other n***a, and are insulted by n*****r.

    I admit, it's a weird social construct I don't entirely get, but it's there, and it's broadly understood.  I guess it's the difference between your friends calling you an a**hole, and some random dude on the street shouting it at you.

    Plebian

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    Re: This is my jam.
    « Reply #794 on: June 12, 2019, 11:59:18 am »
    If you stop to think about it, any member of a minority (whatever it is) will tell you that there is a world of difference between a pejorative term coming from either oneself or someone within your minority, and someone from outside your group using the same pejorative.  Hence, the reason black folks are fine with calling each other n***a, and are insulted by n*****r.

    I admit, it's a weird social construct I don't entirely get, but it's there, and it's broadly understood.  I guess it's the difference between your friends calling you an a**hole, and some random dude on the street shouting it at you.

    And comedians get to cross those lines in the sake of comedy.

    I also do not see how gay, queer OR Mexican is a pejorative term. It is a descriptive term used in that community to categorize. He did not use the term f*****, which is the pejorative.

    Youtube could clearly see it was not harassment, BUT Crowder had to pay even when they agreed he did not violate their rules. Maza has broken TOS many, many times across multiple social media platforms. Yet he is part of the protected class and is beyond criticism.

    You can nitpick as you seem want to do when your argument is solidly refuted, but it is clear enough to even Youtube that Crowder's actions were inline with normal comedic embellishment. Yet Crowder still had to pay.

    If a 'minority' can simply call for action and gets it instantly. Then it would be hard to argue they are in need of protection. It would appear they are in the powerful position.

    "To find out who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize."
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    Raptor

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    Re: This is my jam.
    « Reply #795 on: June 25, 2019, 07:04:02 pm »
    Okay, at risk of fanning the flames of the YouTube brouhaha again (in my defense, it's not available on Spotify yet), may I present:

    PennsylvaniaNon Timebo Mala -- I Will Fear No Evil

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    MTK20

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    Re: This is my jam.
    « Reply #796 on: August 27, 2019, 10:55:17 pm »
    Texas
    Do we forget that cops were primarily still using 6 Shot Revolvers well through the mid 80's? It wasn't until after 1986 that most departments then relented and went to autos.
    Capacity wasn't really an issue then... and honestly really it's not even an issue now.
    Ray Chapman, used to say that the 125-grain Magnum load’s almost magical stopping power was the only reason to load .357 instead of .38 Special +P ammunition into a fighting revolver chambered for the Magnum round. I agree. - Massad Ayoob

    Paradoxically it is those who strive for self-reliance, who remain vigilant and ready to help others.

    MTK20

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    Re: This is my jam.
    « Reply #797 on: September 02, 2019, 04:27:45 pm »

    Texas
    Do we forget that cops were primarily still using 6 Shot Revolvers well through the mid 80's? It wasn't until after 1986 that most departments then relented and went to autos.
    Capacity wasn't really an issue then... and honestly really it's not even an issue now.
    Ray Chapman, used to say that the 125-grain Magnum load’s almost magical stopping power was the only reason to load .357 instead of .38 Special +P ammunition into a fighting revolver chambered for the Magnum round. I agree. - Massad Ayoob

    Paradoxically it is those who strive for self-reliance, who remain vigilant and ready to help others.

    MTK20

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    Re: This is my jam.
    « Reply #798 on: September 13, 2019, 05:12:18 pm »
    In a wistful mood today.







    Texas
    Do we forget that cops were primarily still using 6 Shot Revolvers well through the mid 80's? It wasn't until after 1986 that most departments then relented and went to autos.
    Capacity wasn't really an issue then... and honestly really it's not even an issue now.
    Ray Chapman, used to say that the 125-grain Magnum load’s almost magical stopping power was the only reason to load .357 instead of .38 Special +P ammunition into a fighting revolver chambered for the Magnum round. I agree. - Massad Ayoob

    Paradoxically it is those who strive for self-reliance, who remain vigilant and ready to help others.

    MTK20

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    Re: This is my jam.
    « Reply #799 on: September 23, 2019, 11:54:26 am »
    Someone found a time machine.

    Texas
    Do we forget that cops were primarily still using 6 Shot Revolvers well through the mid 80's? It wasn't until after 1986 that most departments then relented and went to autos.
    Capacity wasn't really an issue then... and honestly really it's not even an issue now.
    Ray Chapman, used to say that the 125-grain Magnum load’s almost magical stopping power was the only reason to load .357 instead of .38 Special +P ammunition into a fighting revolver chambered for the Magnum round. I agree. - Massad Ayoob

    Paradoxically it is those who strive for self-reliance, who remain vigilant and ready to help others.

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