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Author Topic: .32 S&W penetration  (Read 11630 times)

RMc

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.32 S&W penetration
« on: July 31, 2017, 11:27:33 pm »
"Indeed, the 32 S&W has a poor reputation as a man stopper. But to our surprise, these bullets passed through four layers of denim and penetrated 14 inches into the gel."

http://www.guns.com/review/gun-review-iver-johnson-safety-automatic-revolver-in-32-sw/

Who would have thought?   :hmm
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    MTK20

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    Re: .32 S&W penetration
    « Reply #1 on: July 31, 2017, 11:56:19 pm »
    While not potent for an enraged or motivated attacker, I believe this is the cartridge known for burying many a hapless gambler whose luck was a little too good at the card table.
    Texas
    Do we forget that cops were primarily still using 6 Shot Revolvers well through the mid 80's? It wasn't until after 1986 that most departments then relented and went to autos.
    Capacity wasn't really an issue then... and honestly really it's not even an issue now.
    Ray Chapman, used to say that the 125-grain Magnum load’s almost magical stopping power was the only reason to load .357 instead of .38 Special +P ammunition into a fighting revolver chambered for the Magnum round. I agree. - Massad Ayoob

    Paradoxically it is those who strive for self-reliance, who remain vigilant and ready to help others.

    coelacanth

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    Re: .32 S&W penetration
    « Reply #2 on: August 01, 2017, 02:56:49 pm »
    I won't rehash my own personal anecdote here but I definitely don't want anybody shooting at me with a .30 caliber projectile out of anything more serious than a Nerf gun. 
    Arizona" A republic, if you can keep it."

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    MTK20

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    Re: .32 S&W penetration
    « Reply #3 on: August 01, 2017, 03:44:13 pm »
    I won't rehash my own personal anecdote here but I definitely don't want anybody shooting at me with a .30 caliber projectile out of anything more serious than a Nerf gun.

    Can't be a rehash if one hasn't heard it before  ;).
    Texas
    Do we forget that cops were primarily still using 6 Shot Revolvers well through the mid 80's? It wasn't until after 1986 that most departments then relented and went to autos.
    Capacity wasn't really an issue then... and honestly really it's not even an issue now.
    Ray Chapman, used to say that the 125-grain Magnum load’s almost magical stopping power was the only reason to load .357 instead of .38 Special +P ammunition into a fighting revolver chambered for the Magnum round. I agree. - Massad Ayoob

    Paradoxically it is those who strive for self-reliance, who remain vigilant and ready to help others.

    RMc

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    Re: .32 S&W penetration
    « Reply #4 on: August 01, 2017, 03:55:30 pm »
    While not potent for an enraged or motivated attacker, I believe this is the cartridge known for burying many a hapless gambler whose luck was a little too good at the card table.

    Most surprising is this diminutive 19th century round had sufficient penetration to reach the "vitals" - under modern standards!
    « Last Edit: August 01, 2017, 05:10:44 pm by RMc »
    Alabama

    MTK20

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    Re: .32 S&W penetration
    « Reply #5 on: August 01, 2017, 04:22:51 pm »
     :thumbup1

    Just realised I own that revolver, btw  :rotfl. Well, a family member does, but I have never shot it.
    Texas
    Do we forget that cops were primarily still using 6 Shot Revolvers well through the mid 80's? It wasn't until after 1986 that most departments then relented and went to autos.
    Capacity wasn't really an issue then... and honestly really it's not even an issue now.
    Ray Chapman, used to say that the 125-grain Magnum load’s almost magical stopping power was the only reason to load .357 instead of .38 Special +P ammunition into a fighting revolver chambered for the Magnum round. I agree. - Massad Ayoob

    Paradoxically it is those who strive for self-reliance, who remain vigilant and ready to help others.

    coelacanth

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    Re: .32 S&W penetration
    « Reply #6 on: August 01, 2017, 07:05:23 pm »
    All of the .30 caliber handguns were very popular back in the day.  The .32 S&W, .32 Short Colt, .32 ACP, 7.62 Mauser, 7.62 Tokarev, 7.62 Nagant, 32-20 Winchester and so on.   Today we are left primarily with the .32 ACP, .32 H&R magnum, .327 Federal and the venerable 32-20 Winchester. 

    Ruger still chambers the Blackhawk revolver in .30 carbine also but I don't think any other stock handgun can use that one AFAIK.   

    The .30 caliber rounds have always enjoyed a good reputation as emphatic killers of varmints and small game and they were also popular as self defense weapons for a very long time.  In many places they still are - particularly those that forbid civilian ownership of any weapons chambered in military cartridges. 

    Can't be a rehash if one hasn't heard it before  ;).
    It was an incident that happened to a co-worker many years ago.  The incident was remarkably similar to your description:

    While not potent for an enraged or motivated attacker, I believe this is the cartridge known for burying many a hapless gambler whose luck was a little too good at the card table.

    Apparently a "friendly" card game turned decidedly less so and he took five rounds of .32 ACP to the chest from across a kitchen table.  He fell to the floor, bled out and was unconscious when the ambulance arrived ten minutes later.  He died of his wounds a short time later.

    We used to load "mouse fart" loads in an old .30-30 rifle using No. 1 round lead shot and at about 800-900 fps (estimated) those loads were deadly on rabbits and the occasional ground hog.  A .30 caliber round of any sort is not an inconsequential thing.   :hmm
    Arizona" A republic, if you can keep it."

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    Re: .32 S&W penetration
    « Reply #7 on: August 01, 2017, 07:10:56 pm »
    Once upon a time, Ruger made a short run (possibly a special order for Davidson or Lipsey) that came with three cylinders; .30 Carbine, .32-20, and .32 H&R Magnum.  It was one of those things that would have been fun, just for the "gee-whiz" factor.
    Alabama"Stand your ground!  Don't fire unless fired upon, but if they mean to have a war, let it begin here!"  Capt. John Parker

    coelacanth

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    Re: .32 S&W penetration
    « Reply #8 on: August 01, 2017, 07:16:12 pm »
    Yup.  They are scarce as hen's teeth and usually bring a bloody fortune on the used gun market assuming you actually find one for sale.  The last one I saw for sale was missing one of the cylinders ( the 32-20 I think ) and a good bit of its original finish and the galoot was still asking $1200 for the thing.   :facepalm
    Arizona" A republic, if you can keep it."

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    Mikee5star

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    Re: .32 S&W penetration
    « Reply #9 on: August 01, 2017, 10:16:28 pm »
    My Grandfather was shot with a .32 S&W when my mother was one year old.  He confronted a neighbor for stealing chickens, and the bastard shot him.  He walked home, drove to the hospital (Grandma never drove, except in the fields), they looked at him, he was shot below the belt, rolled him into a corner and left him to die.  When he did not die by the morning, so they took another look and did whatever they did, and he recovered.  What happened to the neighbor I never heard.

    Still don't want to be shot with one.
    Alaska

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    Re: .32 S&W penetration
    « Reply #10 on: August 01, 2017, 10:28:15 pm »
    Once caught a 7.62X25 round in the left thigh.  Would have been worse, I'm sure, but it bounced off the only rock in a 5-mile radius, and was almost square when I caught it.  Was shallow enough that the corpsman could see it down at the bottom of the hole.  Having that [expletive deleted] pull it out with a pair of needle nose pliers was worse than catching it in the first place!
    Alabama"Stand your ground!  Don't fire unless fired upon, but if they mean to have a war, let it begin here!"  Capt. John Parker

    Plebian

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    Re: .32 S&W penetration
    « Reply #11 on: August 01, 2017, 11:30:44 pm »
    My little 38 S&W break top shot clean through a broadside deer.

    Some of those older anemic rounds have some crazy penetration for such low velocity and energy.
    Oklahoma"If all our problems are solved, we'll find new ones to replace them. If we can't find new ones, we'll make new ones."

    MTK20

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    Re: .32 S&W penetration
    « Reply #12 on: August 02, 2017, 12:14:13 am »
    *Looks around at thread*

    So uh, who here hasn't been shot by a 30 calibre handgun?  :shocked
    Texas
    Do we forget that cops were primarily still using 6 Shot Revolvers well through the mid 80's? It wasn't until after 1986 that most departments then relented and went to autos.
    Capacity wasn't really an issue then... and honestly really it's not even an issue now.
    Ray Chapman, used to say that the 125-grain Magnum load’s almost magical stopping power was the only reason to load .357 instead of .38 Special +P ammunition into a fighting revolver chambered for the Magnum round. I agree. - Massad Ayoob

    Paradoxically it is those who strive for self-reliance, who remain vigilant and ready to help others.

    Plebian

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    Re: .32 S&W penetration
    « Reply #13 on: August 02, 2017, 12:17:02 am »
    *Looks around at thread*

    So uh, who here hasn't been shot by a 30 calibre handgun?  :shocked

    I have only been shot by a 22lr in the shin. My main lesson learned was that shooting at old toilets is a bad idea. There can be pretty good ricochets.
    Oklahoma"If all our problems are solved, we'll find new ones to replace them. If we can't find new ones, we'll make new ones."

    coelacanth

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    Re: .32 S&W penetration
    « Reply #14 on: August 02, 2017, 12:17:18 am »
    *Looks around at thread*

    So uh, who here hasn't been shot by a 30 calibre handgun?  :shocked


    Me, but I knew a guy once .  .  . 
    Arizona" A republic, if you can keep it."

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    Raptor

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    Re: .32 S&W penetration
    « Reply #15 on: August 02, 2017, 12:22:09 am »
    *Looks around at thread*

    So uh, who here hasn't been shot by a 30 calibre handgun?  :shocked

    Only things I've been shot by are .68-caliber paintball guns and a 6mm airsoft pistol. The airsoft pistol was an accident. Have to remember to thank Little Brother again for that.

    In the unlikely event that anyone here has a solid frame .32 S&W Long /.32 Colt New Police (not the same as regular .32 S&W, I know), Buffalo Bore is loading high(er) pressure wadcutter and LFN loads for defensive ammo.
    PennsylvaniaNon Timebo Mala -- I Will Fear No Evil

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    MTK20

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    Re: .32 S&W penetration
    « Reply #16 on: August 02, 2017, 12:26:26 am »
    I got hit by spalding of some sort. A fragment of either the round or the rocks it hit at the gun range. Made my cheek bleed beneath my left eye.

    Dude really shouldn't have shot an AR15 next to me (I was down range setting up steel plates). I kind of lost faith in the shooting lanes that day.

    I do have to laugh that of all things, I got hit with something out of an AR. That's the scary, infinitely deadly one they say  :P .
    Texas
    Do we forget that cops were primarily still using 6 Shot Revolvers well through the mid 80's? It wasn't until after 1986 that most departments then relented and went to autos.
    Capacity wasn't really an issue then... and honestly really it's not even an issue now.
    Ray Chapman, used to say that the 125-grain Magnum load’s almost magical stopping power was the only reason to load .357 instead of .38 Special +P ammunition into a fighting revolver chambered for the Magnum round. I agree. - Massad Ayoob

    Paradoxically it is those who strive for self-reliance, who remain vigilant and ready to help others.

    First Shirt

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    Re: .32 S&W penetration
    « Reply #17 on: August 02, 2017, 12:18:46 pm »
    Under the heading of "wild hare ideas" could a .32 H&R Magnum cylinder be machined to take moon clips to allow the use of .30 Carbine?  Could you find moon clips for it, if it could?
    Alabama"Stand your ground!  Don't fire unless fired upon, but if they mean to have a war, let it begin here!"  Capt. John Parker

    LowKey

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    Re: .32 S&W penetration
    « Reply #18 on: August 02, 2017, 02:11:46 pm »
    *Looks around at thread*

    So uh, who here hasn't been shot by a 30 calibre handgun?  :shocked
    Me. I got hit with one round of .45ACP ball in an extremity at close range.  Went right through,  blew out some bone shards but left a neat and reasonable clean hole.   Throbbed like a sumb____  for a week.

    Raptor

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    Re: .32 S&W penetration
    « Reply #19 on: August 02, 2017, 02:25:50 pm »
    Under the heading of "wild hare ideas" could a .32 H&R Magnum cylinder be machined to take moon clips to allow the use of .30 Carbine?  Could you find moon clips for it, if it could?

    Dunno if it's physically possible, but it wouldn't work either way: SAAMI rates .32 H&R at 21,000 CUP Maximum Average Pressure, while .30 Carbine is rated at 40,000 CUP Maximum Average Pressure. If you were converting a standard .32 H&R cylinder, it'd probably blow up the first time you fired it.
    PennsylvaniaNon Timebo Mala -- I Will Fear No Evil

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    Re: .32 S&W penetration
    « Reply #20 on: August 02, 2017, 03:53:33 pm »
    Hadn't considered the differences in chamber pressures. :doh

    Thanks!  Back to the drawing board, I guess.
    Alabama"Stand your ground!  Don't fire unless fired upon, but if they mean to have a war, let it begin here!"  Capt. John Parker

    sqlbullet

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    Re: .32 S&W penetration
    « Reply #21 on: August 02, 2017, 04:10:26 pm »
    327 Federal would be  better starting point since that cartridge is rated for 45,000 PSI.

    But, there are other issues too.  Taper case vs straight wall.  And the 30 carbine taper is smaller than the 327 Federal at the neck, but larger than the 327 federal at the head.  By the time you get 30 carbine  brass to chamber, the gun probably won't be safe for 327 federal anymore.

    Even if all that did work out, the 30 carbine shoots a .308 bullet, where the 327 shoots a .312.  So, even if it weren't for the other issues, accuracy would probably be pretty bad.
    Utah

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    Re: .32 S&W penetration
    « Reply #22 on: August 03, 2017, 03:12:21 pm »
    Wonder how Ruger got away with the three-cylinder combo?  If it would work with .32-20 and .32 H&R, it wouldn't work with .30 Carbine, and vice versa.
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    sqlbullet

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    Re: .32 S&W penetration
    « Reply #23 on: August 03, 2017, 05:43:21 pm »
    Use a 308 barrel.  The .312 bullets will squeeze right down with little issue.
    Utah

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    Re: .32 S&W penetration
    « Reply #24 on: August 03, 2017, 06:31:03 pm »
    Use a 308 barrel.  The .312 bullets will squeeze right down with little issue.
    Might send the pressures up a bit, all things considered.  Don't you think?  I'm a big fan of .452 bullets in a .451 barrel, but that's about as far as I'm willing to go.
    Alabama"Stand your ground!  Don't fire unless fired upon, but if they mean to have a war, let it begin here!"  Capt. John Parker

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