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Author Topic: TEOTWAWKI is a BS Scenario Made-Up to Sell You Crap  (Read 7842 times)

TommyGunn

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Re: TEOTWAWKI is a BS Scenario Made-Up to Sell You Crap
« Reply #25 on: August 07, 2012, 12:28:40 pm »
Quote
if a plausible event, however likely or unlikely, hasn't happened yet you have to ask why not.


Like...um, why people didn't ask on Saturday December the 6th why the Japanese haven't attacked Pearl Harbor yet? :panic :whistle :nervous
"Through ignorance of what is good and what is bad, the life of men is greatly perplexed." ~~ Cicero.

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    Coronach

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    Re: Re: TEOTWAWKI is a BS Scenario Made-Up to Sell You Crap
    « Reply #26 on: August 07, 2012, 12:30:34 pm »
    Argentina was relatively first world and from what I've read people were killing each other for food within a week of their economic collapse.
    I was just about to cite Argentina.

    There are several different ways to look at TEOTWAWKI. One is a 'real' doomsday scenario, like a massive rock falls out of the sky (which has happened before and will happen again) to the Yellowstone caldera popping off (which will eventually happen again, too). Those can range from Game Over, to the planet flashing "TILT", all the way down to just a royal mess. Then there is societal and economic collapse brought on by more mundane things, like idiocy in high places. For examples of what economic collapse looks like, look to Argentina, Weimar Germany, Greece, Zimbabwe, Somalia, etc. As Nightcrawler said, the end of the world as we know it still is not the end of the world. There will be massive change, some positive numbers recorded on the suckmeter, and then you move on.

    Making REASONABLE preps is a good thing. It always is. Friends of mine were sans power for almost two weeks this year. Your TEOTWAWKI preps would certainly come in handy for a mundane little disaster like a wind storm. If nothing else, by being self sufficient you free up resources to go help the foolish (my friends were totally in the foolish category, btw) and people who got really slammed through no fault of their own. People deriding preppers seem to do the following:

    1. It ain't gonna happen.
    2. If it does happen, it will be so big the only thing to survive will be cockroaches, twinkies, and Pam Anderson's breasts. So it's no use trying.

    What they fail to consider is that there are a whole host of sub-apocalypse scenarios that are a lot more survivable and comfortable if you have a bunch of stuff on hand, and know how to use it, before it starts. The key is to keep it reasonable. Don't waste money on two tons of whole wheat flour if you don't ever use whole wheat flour. It will go to waste. However, if you do a lot of cooking with Bisquick, there's nothing wrong with having 50 lbs of it in the basement, as long as you rotate it through fast enough to avoid spoilage.

    Mike

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    Nick Cage

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    Re: TEOTWAWKI is a BS Scenario Made-Up to Sell You Crap
    « Reply #27 on: August 07, 2012, 03:23:03 pm »
    After riding out two hurricanes I've gotta say life is better in the south with A/C even when said A/C is run off of a Generator and your 30 gallons of gas you had stored :-)
    Not exactly LONG term preps but its stuff I keep on hand.

    Along with the stuff to keep me fed and my stuff mine.

    Atlas8193

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    Re: TEOTWAWKI is a BS Scenario Made-Up to Sell You Crap
    « Reply #28 on: August 07, 2012, 05:25:14 pm »
    His mention of a pandemic being bogus is false. I cite the following...

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1918_flu_pandemic

    ...And give my logic behind my opinion that his statement is false.

    1A-methods of travel have changed and accelerated. In 1918 the primary methods of travel were by boat (trans-Atlantic and/or Pacific), and train (interstate and international in the case of Europe). Now we have planes that can make the trans-oceanic trip in hours rather than days or weeks. Cars can now even get you across Europe on it's developed highway system in a few days.

    1B-it is because of the potential for rapid dispersion of the pandemic that pharmaceutical companies may (as in "probably") companies would not be able to react to the immensity of the outbreak/pandemic; even with a unified force.

    2-while modern medicine has developed and evolved, so have the diseases it fights. Penicillin (which I am actually badly allergic too) was once a wonder drug and is/was responsible for saving countless lives. Now it won't even solve most cases of strep throat. MRSA (a link here -> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Methicillin-resistant_Staphylococcus_aureus ) is a biological phenomenon that is devastating-a bacterial infection with (in some cases) no cure. There are reports of antibiotic strains of tuberculosis in Siberia and other parts of the world as well.

    3-we now know how to engineer "super-bugs". Weaponized disease strains, delivery systems, etc and now much more technologically feasible and effective. They can also be violently unpredictable once deployed.

    In summary, it is my humble opinion that his pandemic argument is flawed.
    Although personally I am quite content with existing explosives, I feel we must not stand in the path of improvement.-Winston Churchill

    russell

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    Re: TEOTWAWKI is a BS Scenario Made-Up to Sell You Crap
    « Reply #29 on: August 07, 2012, 07:37:08 pm »
    "Do you want to know what the US will look like if it falls 20 spaces down from the top of the economic ladder?"

    Since the global economy is tangled up in the US economy, the world will take a financial nose dive as all that debt starts to deleverage. Looking at this chart : http://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?singlepost=2888624 we can see that the GDP is growing mostly because of Federal debt, the plan works as long as there are suckers willing to buy our debt. As soon as the music stops, the US won't fall 20 "spaces" down, it'll affect every nation to an unknown degree.

    To restate, as long as the Fed can replace private credit deleveraging with it's own credit leveraging by borrowing enough to maintain this ratio, no US economy meltdown will occur. And if the US doesn't meltdown, neither will anyone else that is tied up with the US market. But that means the Fed will have to borrow infinitely, and I'm pretty sure that isn't possible.

    "Just visit the UK or France because that’s what it will look like, they were both at the very top of the economic chain and now they have fallen about 20 levels."

    Countries on the verge of economic collapse? Whose major cities are slowly being consumed by Islamic exclaves? Citizens unable to defend themselves against violent mobs of youths? England's rich cultural heritage is being destroyed by waves of immigrants with no desire to continue the English heritage, and this guy thinks that's just ok-doaky?

    Look at England after their Empire collapsed. It's wasn't Max Mad time, but their world most certainly ended as they knew it before when the Sun didn't set on the British Empire. And the world's banking systems weren't tied to England like they are to the US.

    "Lets say the US financially collapses 40 levels down the economic ladder, then it will be like Barbados, Saint Kitts and Nevis and Malta (all popular vacation spots)"

    All propped up by first world tourist money. All of much smaller populations, economic activity and land mass. The comparison is invalid from the start.

    Also, he keeps positioning TEOTWAWKI as complete and utter collapse of everything forever in the US. I call straw man on that one, there are various shades to a collapse, ranging from the Mycenaeans who ceased to exist, to the Eastern Roman Empire that kept going 1,000 years after the Western Empire fell.

    Plus he's basically saying that one shouldn't buy insurance of any kind for ones house since the odds of one needing a specific type of insurance can be slim to none. It's not like my house is going to be washed away in a hurricane, so no need to buy earthquake or fire insurance, right?

    Ugh, I could go on but this guy is wrong.
    Utah

    Splodge Of Doom

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    Re: TEOTWAWKI is a BS Scenario Made-Up to Sell You Crap
    « Reply #30 on: August 10, 2012, 04:40:55 am »
    Countries on the verge of economic collapse? Whose major cities are slowly being consumed by Islamic exclaves? Citizens unable to defend themselves against violent mobs of youths? England's rich cultural heritage is being destroyed by waves of immigrants with no desire to continue the English heritage, and this guy thinks that's just ok-doaky?

    Just want to point out that while there are issues there, out of context they sound much worse than they are. England is not sinking into the depths here. We have less personal freedoms than the US to a small extent, but I would say that our societal issues put us no further down the crapper than you. After all, you guys have turf wars and shoot-outs between gangs, rampant crime in certain areas, and practically an invasion from the south...

    TommyGunn

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    Re: TEOTWAWKI is a BS Scenario Made-Up to Sell You Crap
    « Reply #31 on: August 10, 2012, 11:15:32 am »
    Quote from: Splodge of Doom
    .....you guys have turf wars and shoot-outs between gangs, rampant crime in certain areas, and practically an invasion from the south...

    Thankfully, these events are hardly standard fare in all our cities on a daily basis....yet.  Thankfully. 
    The "invasion" from the south has been going on for 40 years atleast. 
    But it's not "Mad Max" time here yet.
    "Through ignorance of what is good and what is bad, the life of men is greatly perplexed." ~~ Cicero.

    Splodge Of Doom

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    Re: TEOTWAWKI is a BS Scenario Made-Up to Sell You Crap
    « Reply #32 on: August 10, 2012, 11:21:47 am »
    Thankfully, these events are hardly standard fare in all our cities on a daily basis....yet.  Thankfully. 
    The "invasion" from the south has been going on for 40 years atleast. 
    But it's not "Mad Max" time here yet.

    My point exactly. Context is important.

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