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Author Topic: shaking plains  (Read 4379 times)

Chief45

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shaking plains
« on: September 03, 2016, 05:33:35 pm »
interesting wake up this morning.

house started shaking.   for the west coast, probably no big deal.  for Kansas,  that's a WHAT ?   Earthquake ?  Dad burn it, that was not in the brochure, Tornadoes, thunderstorms, straight line winds, hail, snow, ice storms, freezing rain, drought, yeah, we got all that. 

actually, that is about the 4th or 5th time over the last 3 or 4 years.

5.6 on the scale,  Pawnee, Ok.  about 7 am. I'm about 160 NE of there and it brought me out of a sound sleep.  with feet on the floor, I could feel the aftershocks for about a minute.  no damage, just a heck of a wake up call.



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    Kaso

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    Re: shaking plains
    « Reply #1 on: September 03, 2016, 06:41:55 pm »
     Glad to hear you are alright.  I have some relatives in Tulsa that I would not mind if the earth swallowed up... but not this time.  :-\

    Plebian

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    Re: shaking plains
    « Reply #2 on: September 03, 2016, 06:55:41 pm »
    My house is about 80 miles south of Pawnee.

    All the dogs went on high alert and the wife woke from the dead at 7 when the quake hit.

    I was out on the patio when it hit, and I could feel the ground move a few inches below my feet. No one had any damage here, and our house is fine with no cracks anywhere.
    Oklahoma"If all our problems are solved, we'll find new ones to replace them. If we can't find new ones, we'll make new ones."

    Mikee5star

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    Re: shaking plains
    « Reply #3 on: September 03, 2016, 07:21:59 pm »
    5.6 is a pretty good shake. Was it deep or shallow?
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    Plebian

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    Re: shaking plains
    « Reply #4 on: September 03, 2016, 07:47:34 pm »
    5.6 is a pretty good shake. Was it deep or shallow?
    Shallow. I think they said 3.7 or so down.
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    Re: shaking plains
    « Reply #5 on: September 03, 2016, 11:31:39 pm »
    Nice and wavy then.  Deep ones feel like a truck hit the house.
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    HMPlatinum

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    Re: shaking plains
    « Reply #6 on: September 06, 2016, 06:43:40 am »
    Glad everyone is OK.
    I didn't feel a thing in SEMO.
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    sarge712

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    Re: shaking plains
    « Reply #7 on: September 06, 2016, 07:24:16 am »
    The New Madrid fault line is supposed to be as bad as the San Andreas in Cali. In 1812 the Mississippi was supposed to have flowed backwards for a time following that major quake.
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    ksuguy

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    Re: shaking plains
    « Reply #8 on: September 06, 2016, 07:40:06 am »
    The oil industry probably does need to cut back on the wastewater injection.  I know that people are quick to say fluff off to the environmentalist hippies as a matter of principle,   but I think it is pretty clear that a lot of the recent earthquake activity is related.   

    I don't think we need to completely stop fracking or anything,  but they need to figure out a better way to handle the wastewater instead of putting it all back into the ground, because that is what really causes the problems. 
    Kansas

    GeorgeHill

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    Re: shaking plains
    « Reply #9 on: September 06, 2016, 08:53:22 am »
    I've studied fracking in detail.  I've talked to geologist about it.  I've talked to the people who do fracking.  I've talked to people on both sides of the issue.   Here's the thing... It really doesn't do a lot of actual fracturing and people can get really hysterical about it.   Mostly what it does is greats a high pressure pocket that forces oil up and out where it can be extracted.   It's more like blowing bubbles in ice water than pounding the earths crust to get all the earth blood out. 
    Fracking doesn't cause earthquakes.  It's far too small to effect something far too large.

    The fluids they use though - that's where the problems could be.  If toxic fluids get into ground water - that's the problem.  And every company uses a different fluid mix.   That should be regulated.  Because right now they can inject anything they want.
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    Kaso

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    Re: shaking plains
    « Reply #10 on: September 06, 2016, 09:10:55 am »
    The fluids they use though - that's where the problems could be.  If toxic fluids get into ground water - that's the problem.  And every company uses a different fluid mix.   That should be regulated.  Because right now they can inject anything they want.
    I agree with your whole post - fracking itself is not a big issue.  The bolded sentence is.  In my township we have several residents whose water has been contaminated with all sorts of fun stuff.  Mostly because of the 'ponds' where it is stored between uses.  One in particular had a young daughter who had some of these chemicals found in her system.  (I forget which chemicals.  Never thought I would need to remember.)  She is 8-9, and is probably going to be dealing with health effects years down the road.

    Also in our county, we have had residents making a big show of lighting their tap water (from a well) on fire.  I never verified the authenticity, but to me that seems suspect.

    wyatt

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    Re: shaking plains
    « Reply #11 on: September 06, 2016, 01:40:35 pm »
    My family has been living in Oklahoma and Texas since the 1800's. There were earthquakes here back then too.

    booksmart

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    Re: shaking plains
    « Reply #12 on: September 06, 2016, 01:50:46 pm »
    It isn't whether they occurred or not, but the sheer frequency that should cause you concern...

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009%E2%80%9316_Oklahoma_earthquake_swarms

    wyatt

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    Re: shaking plains
    « Reply #13 on: September 06, 2016, 02:53:59 pm »
    We've only been keeping records here since about 1900, give or take a few years. 116 years isn't even a millisecond in geological time. There isn't enough data to compare with what happened here 500 years ago or 500,000 years ago.

    StevenTing

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    Re: shaking plains
    « Reply #14 on: September 06, 2016, 03:01:59 pm »
    I haven't been in an earthquake since I left California.  Back then, I didn't care and just stayed in bed.  There was nothing above me to fall on me and if the ceiling fell, it wouldn't matter where I was.  So I just stayed in bed.

    In terms of fracking, I've watched lots of videos on it because I invested in a couple of oil outfits and wanted to understand what they're doing.  Maybe it's changed but I don't think people understand what is really going on.  It's just the next band wagon to jump on.
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    RetroGrouch

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    Re: shaking plains
    « Reply #15 on: September 06, 2016, 03:32:50 pm »
    These earthquakes, if caused by fracking, were meta-stable faults just waiting for a trigger anyways.  You can't inject enough water to cause an earthquake.  But if you have a fault with some stored energy, and you disrupt the conditions around it by removing a gas and injecting much denser and less compressible water, maybe with with some other things that would lubricate the fault line, you could trigger the fault to move.


    Or it just may be we are moving into a more geologically active time.  Have you noticed how many major earthquakes not associated with fracking and volcanic eruptions we've seen lately?
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    Plebian

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    Re: shaking plains
    « Reply #16 on: September 06, 2016, 04:51:39 pm »
    I know the group of geologist studying the waste water injection here in OK. We have always had small tremors here, and there is a fairly major fault that cuts across OK.

    It is about split on opinion among the fellows that are neck deep into the studies here.

    There are about half of them saying the water injection could likely be a good thing relieving stress along the fault line. It may be better to have many small tremors than one big one sorta idea.

    The other camp are just not sure on the cause exactly and wish to study it closer while slowing down on the waste water wells in certain areas.

    I tend to side on the use caution side, and it seems the state government believes so as well. Since the state shut down many of the injection wells in 'sensitive areas' for further study.

    Either way the local rock humpers are just running about with massive stiffies with all the seismic action.

    Fracking is much like Nuclear power. Fracking sounds bad, and if someone screws it up then it can be very serious. However, just like nuclear power nobody gives a crap the 99.99999% of the time it goes right and just take the heat/electricity for granted in their homes. 
    Oklahoma"If all our problems are solved, we'll find new ones to replace them. If we can't find new ones, we'll make new ones."

    booksmart

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    Re: shaking plains
    « Reply #17 on: September 06, 2016, 05:12:00 pm »
    http://newsok.com/article/5412370

    Quote
    Using some of its strongest language to date, the Oklahoma Geological Survey said Tuesday the state’s ongoing earthquake swarm is “very unlikely to represent a naturally occurring process.”

    The state survey said the suspected source of triggered earthquakes is the use of wastewater disposal wells that dump large amounts of water produced along with oil production.

    “The observed seismicity of greatest concentration, namely in central and north-central Oklahoma, can be observed to follow the oil and gas plays characterized by large amounts of produced water,” the report stated. “Seismicity rates are observed to increase after a time-delay as injection volumes increase within these plays. In north central and north-central Oklahoma, this time-delay can be weeks to a year or more.”

    wyatt

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    Re: shaking plains
    « Reply #18 on: September 06, 2016, 07:10:22 pm »
    http://newsok.com/article/5412370


    Then do your part and quit buying gas for your car, electricity for your home, food from your grocery store, ect, ect.

    This anti-fracking nonsense is just another leftist scam to bilk the oil companies out of money that will be laundered back into the democratic machine to buy votes. This is about control of people, not earthquakes. 

    sarge712

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    Re: shaking plains
    « Reply #19 on: September 06, 2016, 07:16:10 pm »
    We had a quake here at 3:12pm today just north of town but I didn't feel it. They are becoming more and more frequent.
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    coelacanth

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    Re: shaking plains
    « Reply #20 on: September 06, 2016, 09:35:35 pm »
     :hmm  No fracking in Arizona and we had a quake recently.   Actually they were injecting water into oilfields that were slow producing way back in the early 1960's and there didn't seem to be any increase in seismic activity in those areas.  Some were quite close to the New Madrid fault and seem to have not actually triggered "the BIG one".   :coffee   

    Seems to me that the geologic record indicates there was all sorts of seismic activity prior to the actual existence of subterranean oil deposits - assuming we know how and when those were formed.  You know, sort of like there was a great deal of climate variability before the advent of any measurable human activity on the planet.  Maybe we're not as significant as we think we are.   :hmm
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    MTK20

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    Re: shaking plains
    « Reply #21 on: September 06, 2016, 10:03:39 pm »
    :hmm  No fracking in Arizona and we had a quake recently.   Actually they were injecting water into oilfields that were slow producing way back in the early 1960's and there didn't seem to be any increase in seismic activity in those areas.  Some were quite close to the New Madrid fault and seem to have not actually triggered "the BIG one".   :coffee   

    Seems to me that the geologic record indicates there was all sorts of seismic activity prior to the actual existence of subterranean oil deposits - assuming we know how and when those were formed.  You know, sort of like there was a great deal of climate variability before the advent of any measurable human activity on the planet.  Maybe we're not as significant as we think we are.   :hmm

    I see what you did there  ;).
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    Re: shaking plains
    « Reply #22 on: September 06, 2016, 10:26:24 pm »
     :facepalm

    HMPlatinum

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    Re: shaking plains
    « Reply #23 on: September 07, 2016, 06:48:40 am »
    The New Madrid fault line is supposed to be as bad as the San Andreas in Cali. In 1812 the Mississippi was supposed to have flowed backwards for a time following that major quake.

    Thanks for reminding me.   ;)
    We're all just sitting around here, waiting to get flushed down the Mississippi toilet into some hidden, underground Hell.  (Where did the water go?)
    The New Madrid fault line is "predicted" to go off soon enough. 
    I'm not looking forward to that.
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    Re: shaking plains
    « Reply #24 on: September 07, 2016, 08:02:57 am »
    I was in Castellucio when a big quake hit a couple of weeks ago, and we had 300 dead and thousands homeless.
    The US has far better construction code than here in Italy, and it saves lives, no doubt about it.

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