Author Topic: All Hell Breaking Loose in Boston (Read 21902 times)

Panhead Bill · « **Reply #50 on:** April 19, 2013, 05:02:24 pm »

Quote from: Deathrider1579 on April 19, 2013, 03:51:05 pm

My definition of "reasonable" is unless you see someone run in my house shooting wildly or throwing bombs or some such. You can bring your happy ass back with a warrant.

Problem is that 200 years of lawyers (damn them!) has redefined "reasonable" into some 10-page stupid definition that has no relation to reality.

Bill (the damn lawyer)

WeTheArmed.com

Nick Cage · « **Reply #51 on:** April 19, 2013, 05:19:05 pm »

I'm not really concerned what what lawyers (*hawk spit*) have written or defined.
Rights in the constitution come from a higher authority than them. Popo can come back with a warrant unless there's a gun fight runnin, I don't care if they are looking for Osama Bin Ladin. Not that I have any fantasies about how that would go down, but I have my principals and I'll stick to them.

Coronach · « **Reply #52 on:** April 19, 2013, 06:09:34 pm »

Yeah, you're entitled to your own opinions. The problem you're going to run into is that your opinions are inadmissable in a court of law. 200 years of lawyers and case law, however, are.

You do the math about how well this will work out for you.

Mike

booksmart · « **Reply #53 on:** April 19, 2013, 06:20:40 pm »

But if you do try it, get someone else to hold the videocamera, so it doesn't get broken...

Panhead Bill · « **Reply #54 on:** April 19, 2013, 06:41:44 pm »

Quote from: Deathrider1579 on April 19, 2013, 05:19:05 pm

I'm not really concerned what what lawyers (*hawk spit*) have written or defined.
Rights in the constitution come from a higher authority than them. Popo can come back with a warrant unless there's a gun fight runnin, I don't care if they are looking for Osama Bin Ladin. Not that I have any fantasies about how that would go down, but I have my principals and I'll stick to them.

I'm not trying to get into a spitting match with you, DR, but....

I guess I did mis-speak a little - I blame the lawyers, but ultimately the Supreme Court has interpreted what phrases in the Constitution mean. It doesn't really matter what you think is reasonable, but what the law (as jacked up as it may be) has come to determine what reasonable means.

Standing on principal is all well and good, but you've gotta choose your battles. Having a battle to the death over allowing a cop enter your home doesn't get you anything but dead. Telling them clearly that they don't have your permission to enter, but not forcefully resisting when the insist will allow you to fight another day in court (and not from jail) and then fight the illegal entry as a means to try and change the jacked up interpretation of "reasonable."

I'm not saying that you'd have a fight to the death to keep the police out - but if that's your position ... Well, good luck with that.

Bill

LoneStarNational · « **Reply #55 on:** April 19, 2013, 07:05:13 pm »

I feel like we have the unlawful entry conversation about once a quarter or so. Granted, this time there was a rather unprecedented situation that quite legitimately raised the question. But still........

Where do you guys think the dude is hiding? Still in Boston, escaped the city, or maybe he already holed up in a dark corner somewhere and blew his brains out?

mephisto · « **Reply #56 on:** April 19, 2013, 07:22:42 pm »

Why would you not let them in, given the circumstance?

LoneStarNational · « **Reply #57 on:** April 19, 2013, 07:25:58 pm »

Quote from: mephisto on April 19, 2013, 07:22:42 pm

Why would you not let them in, given the circumstance?

If it were me, probably my "stockpile" of evil black sporting rifles and ammunition retention accessories that would be illegal if I lived in Boston.

For somebody else, their stash of pot. There are lots of reasons an otherwise law abiding citizen might not want popos poking around.

There's also principle, but as discussed before, the careful selection of your battles might be wise.

Actually, I'd probably let them in, and express my appreciation for the tough day of work they're doing.

LoneStarNational · « **Reply #58 on:** April 19, 2013, 08:19:56 pm »

So they found him, and have spent the last half hour trying to flash bang him to death. I assume you all know this by now.

Lupinus · « **Reply #59 on:** April 19, 2013, 08:44:32 pm »

Suspect is now in custody and on his way to the hospital.

LoneStarNational · « **Reply #60 on:** April 19, 2013, 08:44:40 pm »

Hats off to all the LEOs in Boston tonight.

booksmart · « **Reply #61 on:** April 19, 2013, 09:09:40 pm »

BPD won't have to buy drinks for a while, methinks...

Kaso · « **Reply #62 on:** April 19, 2013, 09:11:26 pm »

Idiot should NOT have let himself be taken alive...

Kaso

booksmart · « **Reply #63 on:** April 19, 2013, 09:19:54 pm »

Why not?

(You're gonna kvetch about the judicial costs, aren't you?)

Panhead Bill · « **Reply #64 on:** April 19, 2013, 09:45:31 pm »

Quote from: mephisto on April 19, 2013, 07:22:42 pm

Why would you not let them in, given the circumstance?

Oh - I'd most likely let them in under these circumstances - provided its my choice.

seanp · « **Reply #65 on:** April 19, 2013, 10:00:48 pm »

Oh yeah. Their Auntie who is a lawyer in Toronto is already making big noises in the media about disbelieving the authorities, demanding proof, etc... I'm guessing she thinks she can make her career on this.

booksmart · « **Reply #66 on:** April 19, 2013, 10:05:45 pm »

She oughta listen to their Uncle...

seanp · « **Reply #67 on:** April 19, 2013, 10:08:32 pm »

My guess is they don't see eye to eye on the subject, and have a different stake in the outcome.

Lupinus · « **Reply #68 on:** April 19, 2013, 10:26:14 pm »

Quote from: booksmart on April 19, 2013, 09:19:54 pm

Why not?

(You're gonna kvetch about the judicial costs, aren't you?)

Might not have to worry about that, didn't take long

Lindsey Graham: Obama Should Hold Bombing Suspect as ‘Enemy Combatant’

strangelittleman · « **Reply #69 on:** April 19, 2013, 10:32:04 pm »

Yes and Barry should revoke his citizenship.

Nick Cage · « **Reply #70 on:** April 19, 2013, 10:33:25 pm »

Well I didn't expect them to take him alive no matter what.
I'm impressed.

And in real life non chest internet thumping circumstances, I wouldn't get into a shootout with them over illegally searching my house, I'd protest and lock the door on their ass.
And as non-violently as possible make it as hard to search the premiss as possible as a means of civil disobedience. Then I'd sue the shiznit out of them. Because that is a out right violation of the constitution I don't care what the corrupt, political, decrepit court has to say about it.

strangelittleman · « **Reply #71 on:** April 19, 2013, 10:43:13 pm »

From the perspective of one who's done quite a few fugitive manhunts, consider this:
If you've nothing to hide, why not let them do a security sweep of your house and curtilage in order to (A) give you peace of mind that no boogie men are on your property and (B) so they can move on efficiently and constantly expand their perimeter in order to contain him inside and restrict his movements?

PS: It was just this kind of cooperation that led the lady to notice and report to said authorities, that something was different from when they performed a security sweep of her property, thus leading to his capture. By the way, he was captured within their perimeter, nearly text-book.

Kaso · « **Reply #72 on:** April 19, 2013, 11:18:19 pm »

Quote from: Panhead Bill on April 19, 2013, 09:45:31 pm

Oh - I'd most likely let them in under these circumstances - provided its my choice.

Exactly. I am the police's friend, as long as they are my friends.

Kaso

Kaso · « **Reply #73 on:** April 19, 2013, 11:20:12 pm »

Quote from: Lupinus on April 19, 2013, 10:26:14 pm

Might not have to worry about that, didn't take long

Lindsey Graham: Obama Should Hold Bombing Suspect as ‘Enemy Combatant’

What horsecrap. He is a naturalized citizen - same rights apply.

Kaso

Kaso · « **Reply #74 on:** April 19, 2013, 11:23:42 pm »

Quote from: booksmart on April 19, 2013, 09:19:54 pm

Why not?

(You're gonna kvetch about the judicial costs, aren't you?)

You'd like me to, wouldn't you?

No, actually, because life in federal prison - if he makes it there - is no way to live. (or die)

Kaso