Author Topic: On FAL prices (Read 19055 times)

FMJ · « **on:** June 30, 2010, 06:06:20 pm »

Being that the FAL is a popular, widespread weapon that has seen things in a lot of places from the Falklands to Rhodesia---and that there are tons of places where it was made under license:

How come every time I see FAL prices, they are over $1K? The weapon strikes me as one that should cost less. Is the supply dried up or something?

WeTheArmed.com

Bo Smith · « **Reply #1 on:** June 30, 2010, 06:08:11 pm »

Do you want a quality weapon, or some piece of crap from CAI?

Avenger29 · « **Reply #2 on:** June 30, 2010, 06:15:23 pm »

Quote from: FMJ on June 30, 2010, 06:06:20 pm

Being that the FAL is a popular, widespread weapon that has seen things in a lot of places from the Falklands to Rhodesia---and that there are tons of places where it was made under license:

How come every time I see FAL prices, they are over $1K? The weapon strikes me as one that should cost less. Is the supply dried up or something?

Quality of assembly/US made parts (if it's from parts kits) or quality of new manufacture parts. DSA tooled up to build niche rifles, and you're going to pay for that, big time.

Also, parts kits aren't in huge amounts of supply. You gotta ask yourself how many countries are smelting down the whole rifle or dumping them at the bottom of the sea instead of selling them to the importers.

Bo Smith · « **Reply #3 on:** June 30, 2010, 06:36:42 pm »

There aren't many imported rifles. They don't meet the "sporting" requirements. Barrels are also illegal to import. Then, what is imported must have the requisite number of USA-made parts. When that's all done, it doesn't leave much room for imported parts. Then, you want someone that has more gunsmithing skills than one of the Wicked Witch's flying monkeys putting the whole together. If it's a rifle you want for "social use" you'll want it to run well.

All of those factors contribute to the price of the rifle.

FMJ · « **Reply #4 on:** June 30, 2010, 06:43:34 pm »

So DSA is like the "Arsenal" of FALs?

I saw DH's rifle in the 3-gun thread, and I figured that that STG58 would be nice to have (and I noticed the rail on top of the upper, even). But the handguards get hot too soon apparently.

Bo Smith · « **Reply #5 on:** June 30, 2010, 06:47:32 pm »

DSA is about your only option for "off the shelf" production. Most everything else is at least semi-custom.

Steel handguards are never a good idea without gloves.

FMJ · « **Reply #6 on:** June 30, 2010, 07:02:52 pm »

In other news, GCA '68 and 922(r) especially, need to go to hell.

Are the IMBEL examples any good?

Avenger29 · « **Reply #7 on:** June 30, 2010, 07:09:56 pm »

Quote from: FMJ on June 30, 2010, 07:02:52 pm

In other news, GCA '68 and 922(r) especially, need to go to hell.

Are the IMBEL examples any good?

I think they are usually considered pretty decent, so long as CAI didn't get their hands on them and it wasn't assembled by some hack in his garage.

Grant · « **Reply #8 on:** June 30, 2010, 07:31:11 pm »

Imbel receivers are going for the same prices as generic CAI FALs...... They're considered best after DSA-factory made (I think).

And I'll be the objective one on this thread: CAI doesn't necessarily mean Crap. Just be careful when buying

A LOT...of happy Hesse and blank/generic receivered FAL owners out there.
Alot can be said for in-person inspection.

Also, some FAL's can be found for under $1,000.....I see some Imbel-receivered rifles sell for around $800. Sure, you're taking a chance, but most BAD conversions show themselves. I'm willing to run the risk.

Avenger29 · « **Reply #9 on:** June 30, 2010, 07:38:59 pm »

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A LOT...of happy Hesse and blank/generic receivered FAL owners out there.

It'd be stupid to even think about buying Hesse. Friends don't let friends buy Hesse/vulcan, Special Weapons, etc. Friends really shouldn't let friends buy CAI assembled guns, either...

The safest bet is an STG-58 from DSA for $1150. If you can't afford the extra little bit for that, you aren't going to be able to afford the ammo to run through the gun. Don't go chasing false deals...

FMJ · « **Reply #10 on:** June 30, 2010, 07:50:19 pm »

Is there still such thing as reasonable priced 7.62 NATO? Or should I just stay with the SGL21 [for a long time] the one I want to buy as soon as I can?

Grant · « **Reply #11 on:** June 30, 2010, 07:54:36 pm »

I dunno...I was happy when I got German 7.62 for 50 cents a round...

FN available from J&G for 39 cents a round..plus about 7 cents a round shipping (I heard).

Pretty much assume 7.62 Nato at 50 cents a round. Some good quality company reloads (HSM, Ultramax,etc.) down to about 45 cents. Not much less except for Czech corrosive and Wolf though.

And Avenger: I agree for the most part....however alot hinges on personal experiances

A LOT...of people have had good luck with CAI guns....a LOT have had bad luck.

I look at it objectively because my only experiance has been with a Wasr...pretty hard to mess one of them up.

Alot of people hate Tasco...I've had good luck with their scopes....as in really-good-luck-a-scope-shouldn't-have-survived-that, on 2 occasions, plus "normal" use, not pampered in a safe and range, but riding in a pickup.

Avenger29 · « **Reply #12 on:** June 30, 2010, 08:08:44 pm »

Quote from: FMJ on June 30, 2010, 07:50:19 pm

Is there still such thing as reasonable priced 7.62 NATO? Or should I just stay with the SGL21 [for a long time] the one I want to buy as soon as I can?

Reasonably priced 7.62 Nato doesn't exist any more. You're lucky to get surplus fodder for $.40-.50 cents per round. And surplus ain't going to last forever, either.

The good days of milsurp ammo ended just about a year before I was old enough to buy anything. And that was 5 years ago.

I think you should stick with the plan of getting an intermediate caliber first. Get a .308 later when you can afford it. Same thing for handguns...get a 9mm first, then get a .45 later once you can afford it. Remember, you want to go out and shoot without cringing every time you pull the trigger because half a dollar is flying down range. Plus, you want to be able to stock up some without going broke. 7.62x39 fits that bill just fine. And you of course want to get some .22LR firearms...

Talked to a guy the other month at the range who had an FAL. He said that sadly, he didn't take it out much anymore because of the cost of shooting it.

FMJ · « **Reply #13 on:** June 30, 2010, 08:26:43 pm »

Yes, I plan on getting an [affordable] Glock 17, so my 9x19 option shall be covered. This would most likely happen when I go to Free America. I wouldn't hesitate on a used P226 police trade-in if I can find that, BTW.

And for the .22 option, when I complete Eagle scout (hopefully) in 2 months, I shall have the 452 Lux.

But it's sad to see that the days of cheap milsurp are over. Sounds like all of you had it better growing up; for many reasons.

Avenger29 · « **Reply #14 on:** June 30, 2010, 08:32:40 pm »

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But it's sad to see that the days of cheap milsurp are over. Sounds like all of you had it better growing up; for many reasons.

Take note that I didn't have cool milsurp stuff while growing up. I watched it steadily disappear from the milsurp catalogs I used to drool over, though...

Nightcrawler · « **Reply #15 on:** June 30, 2010, 08:42:53 pm »

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Sounds like all of you had it better growing up; for many reasons.

PFFT. A folding stock on a FAL was a federal offense. Magazine prices were spiraling upward as the supply dwindled. There has been more innovation and expansion in the American firearms industry since the sunset of the federal Assault Weapons Ban than there was in the twenty years before it.

SKS rifles were cheap back in "the day", but pre-ban M16 mags were thirty dollars or more a pop, and that was in 2001 dollars. I don't miss the good old days one bit. I'll pay more for ammo if that's what it takes. The supply of surplus ammo was bound to dry up sooner or later.

The advances we've made in gun rights today were literally unimaginable ten years ago when I was new to The Firing Line. You'd be called a naive fool, at best, if you suggested some of the things that have come to pass would happen. Despite the grumblings of all the kids whose Christmas is ruined if they don't get a pony, we've made a hell of a lot of progress. I wouldn't trade it.

Bo Smith · « **Reply #16 on:** June 30, 2010, 08:48:37 pm »

The problem is that there aren't new ammunition manufacturers. The profit potential is clearly there. We do not need more firearms manufacturers. We need ammunition to run through the firearms we already have.

FMJ · « **Reply #17 on:** June 30, 2010, 08:50:19 pm »

I'll take back what I said. I was originally going to type something different here, but I take it back now that I thought more about it.

But I would be happy with even cheap Garands and Carbines.

Avenger29 · « **Reply #18 on:** June 30, 2010, 08:52:04 pm »

Quote from: Nightcrawler on June 30, 2010, 08:42:53 pm

PFFT. A folding stock on a FAL was a federal offense. Magazine prices were spiraling upward as the supply dwindled. There has been more innovation and expansion in the American firearms industry since the sunset of the federal Assault Weapons Ban than there was in the twenty years before it.

SKS rifles were cheap back in "the day", but pre-ban M16 mags were thirty dollars or more a pop, and that was in 2001 dollars. I don't miss the good old days one bit. I'll pay more for ammo if that's what it takes. The supply of surplus ammo was bound to dry up sooner or later.

The advances we've made in gun rights today were literally unimaginable ten years ago when I was new to The Firing Line. You'd be called a naive fool, at best, if you suggested some of the things that have come to pass would happen. Despite the grumblings of all the kids whose Christmas is ruined if they don't get a pony, we've made a hell of a lot of progress. I wouldn't trade it.

What he said. Ammo is no longer ridiculously cheap, but the stuff we can get is way cool...and the fact that there has been much progress in rights and technology is just absolutely insane...

Quote

But I would be happy with even cheap Garands and Carbines.

That was way back in the day. But CMP guns are reasonably priced these days

Nightcrawler · « **Reply #19 on:** June 30, 2010, 09:35:05 pm »

Yeah, the only cheap Garands in the catalogs in the '90s were the ones with the rewelded receivers, and I've been told those were nothing but trouble.

Avenger29 · « **Reply #20 on:** June 30, 2010, 09:50:48 pm »

Quote from: Nightcrawler on June 30, 2010, 09:35:05 pm

Yeah, the only cheap Garands in the catalogs in the '90s were the ones with the rewelded receivers, and I've been told those were nothing but trouble.

If you buy a reweld...you got shafted. Bad. There's also a whole host of stuff to be wary about. Federal Ordnance was one such manufacture with shady practices...you don't want anything from them.

FMJ · « **Reply #21 on:** July 01, 2010, 12:37:49 am »

I wish we could at least have the ammo prices of ten years ago.

xsquidgator · « **Reply #22 on:** July 01, 2010, 06:11:18 am »

Quote from: FMJ on July 01, 2010, 12:37:49 am

I wish we could at least have the ammo prices of ten years ago.

Here you go! 308 for about 35 cents a round, 223 for about 25 cents per round (using 2009 component prices that I paid)

and if you're willing to do this(below) you can shoot 9/40/45/whatever pistol for about 5 cents a round
Sorry for the thread drift, but if you want to shoot a lot, consider reloading and casting! You won't save money but you will shoot a LOT more for the same money.

How to get almost-free projectiles for reloading:

FMJ · « **Reply #23 on:** July 01, 2010, 10:45:46 am »

Once I live on my own and have funds available, I'm certain I'll reload--no doubt about it.

Deer Hunter · « **Reply #24 on:** July 01, 2010, 12:28:04 pm »

I <3 my FAL.

I bought it for 860 dollars, shipped, from DSA back in 2005. I think that's the right year. If you can, buy straight from DSA. They knock a few bucks off of what is on their website.

And just to stir the pot of yearning...

And a very old picture of your's truly. Not my brew, by the way.