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Author Topic: EAA Zastava P.A.P. 7.62x39  (Read 7420 times)

booksmart

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EAA Zastava P.A.P. 7.62x39
« on: November 09, 2011, 02:36:19 PM »
So, I'm having a moment, here.

I find I'm very, very tempted, to get what would really amount to a frivolous firearm purchase:

http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/36_230/products_id/60428

The part of me that wants to live is whispering in my ear to save up and pay cash...

I've done some research, and they get pretty good marks, with the exception of the rail on the dustcover...

Anybody else got an opinion on them?

I'm not worried about the 10 round capacity.  WASR mags will apparently work fine in them, and @ $13ish a pop, not cost an arm and a leg.

Help.


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JesseL

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Re: EAA Zastava P.A.P. 7.62x39
« Reply #1 on: November 09, 2011, 02:55:55 PM »
I wouldn't bother with it.

For less money you could have an uncoverted Saiga. Then get you a better quality base gun and without the angle cut receiver, so if you ever decided to come to your senses and turn it into what it's meant to be (standard AK mags, pistol grip, etc) the process would be pretty straightforward.  ;D

http://www.jgsales.com/saiga-7.62x39-sporter-rifle,-tgi-import,-new.-p-5888.html
« Last Edit: November 09, 2011, 04:09:04 PM by JesseL »
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booksmart

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Re: EAA Zastava P.A.P. 7.62x39
« Reply #2 on: November 09, 2011, 03:03:17 PM »
I actually like the thumbhole stock...  :hide

(would prefer it in lumber, though, to be honest)

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Re: EAA Zastava P.A.P. 7.62x39
« Reply #3 on: November 09, 2011, 03:56:47 PM »
Quote
the process would be pretty straightforward

Do tell.
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Re: EAA Zastava P.A.P. 7.62x39
« Reply #4 on: November 09, 2011, 04:16:46 PM »
Quote
(would prefer it in lumber, though, to be honest)

Funny you should say that. The first time I saw these was a the NRA convention is Louisville (whis was, what?, two or three years ago?). Anyway, at that time, the display model had a nice hardwood stock and forearm. Overall, I thought it was a better put together rifle than the Saiga(I may not have known about the angle cut receiver issue at that time).

So anyway, time goes by, and EAA's website keeps saying "Coming Soon!" I read a few rumors that these had been imported, but were stuck in customs. Obama is elected, and, well, you probably remember what happened to the gun market then. But I never see any of these for sale.

Until one day I was surfing Gun Broker and see one. With the same plastic furniture they are currently using. So I ask my LGS to order one, but I want the wood furniture. At that time, some distributors were listing this as an option. A week later, I go to pick up my rifle, and it has the plastic furniture. The dealer says "No problem, i can send it back". And that is the last PAP I have seen.

Rob
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Re: EAA Zastava P.A.P. 7.62x39
« Reply #5 on: November 09, 2011, 05:02:10 PM »
I'm gonna go with Jesse on this one, I've looked at the PAPS and the Saigas are a better buy
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Re: EAA Zastava P.A.P. 7.62x39
« Reply #6 on: November 09, 2011, 05:09:47 PM »
What Jesse said; it just makes more sense.
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booksmart

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Re: EAA Zastava P.A.P. 7.62x39
« Reply #7 on: November 09, 2011, 05:19:43 PM »
Well, that's three people who's opinion on commie guns I trust, so I'll return to saving up for the Storm.

So, what's the "angle cut receiver" issue?  Higher rate of FTEs?

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Re: EAA Zastava P.A.P. 7.62x39
« Reply #8 on: November 09, 2011, 05:35:24 PM »
You just can't put a normal stock on it.  If you don't mind the thumbhole, its not an issue.
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Re: EAA Zastava P.A.P. 7.62x39
« Reply #9 on: November 09, 2011, 06:20:53 PM »
   Already said but I gotta go Saiga as well.

 After awhile you'll want the more-than-10 rounders and a real AK buttstock  ;D  Or, if you like the thumbhole buttstock, keep an eye out for a Wasr, either low or hi-cap.   Just be sure what to look for and you'll be fine.

 

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Re: EAA Zastava P.A.P. 7.62x39
« Reply #10 on: November 10, 2011, 11:59:26 PM »
There are better AKs out there... Pass this one up. Unless you really dig it.
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Re: EAA Zastava P.A.P. 7.62x39
« Reply #11 on: November 11, 2011, 09:05:09 AM »
Well, I like the thumbhole stock (I would think it would add some balance against the weight of the rest of the rifle, plus the ergonomics of a pistol grip). 

My understanding is that the receiver is milled, not stamped (milled>stamped, yeah?).

Made in Serbia (formerly Yugoslavia)? How does that effect things?

I would prefer wood furniture (I like the classics).

Regarding 7.62xx, I have no horse in the race regarding 39 vs 54.

To be clear, I won't be buying one (certain threats were made by The Wife), I'm just fishing for information and edumacation. Link suggstions?

Two of the links I used to read up:

http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?/topic/40849-eaa-zastava-762x39-i-couldnt-resist/

http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?/topic/29353-eaa-is-importing-zastava-serbian-sporter-aks/page__hl__zastava


JesseL

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Re: EAA Zastava P.A.P. 7.62x39
« Reply #12 on: November 11, 2011, 10:54:47 AM »
To address some of those points:

Have you handled a pistol gripped AK? They actually balance pretty well. Even mine with plastic furniture balances nicely.

That receiver is definitely stamped, though it is based on an RPK receiver with heavier gauge sheet metal and a larger front trunnion. Personally, I don't think the supposed advantages of a milled receiver are particularly significant.



The only thing about Yugo guns that I find noteworthy is that they typically lack chromed bores.


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booksmart

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Re: EAA Zastava P.A.P. 7.62x39
« Reply #13 on: November 11, 2011, 11:41:41 AM »
Have you handled a pistol gripped AK? They actually balance pretty well. Even mine with plastic furniture balances nicely.

Not with a loaded mag, no (yes, I am woefully lacking in fun gun experience. We've covered this.  ;) ).

Quote
The only thing about Yugo guns that I find noteworthy is that they typically lack chromed bores.

Is this a good thing or a bad thing?


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Il Rob

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Re: EAA Zastava P.A.P. 7.62x39
« Reply #14 on: November 11, 2011, 11:49:36 AM »
May be straying a bit off topic, but this is regarding the milled versus stamped AK receiver. When I read The Gun by CJ Chivers (recommended by the way), Chivers claimed the original design called for a stamped receiver. The Russians had a hard time actually producing the stamped recivers, so they substituted a milled receiver. Later on, whatever issues the Russians had, they figured out and the result was the AKM. Maybe this is common knowledge, but it was news to me.

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Re: EAA Zastava P.A.P. 7.62x39
« Reply #15 on: November 11, 2011, 11:58:40 AM »
Not with a loaded mag, no (yes, I am woefully lacking in fun gun experience. We've covered this.  ;) ).


Just for reference then, my AK balances right at the front of the magazine - which I'd say is almost perfect.



Quote
Is this a good thing or a bad thing?


Bad, but not terribly so. Non-chromed bores are more vulnerable to corrosion and wear, but I think that's probably a bigger concern when you're living in a third-world s___hole and have full auto available.

With rudimentary cleaning and not running the barrel red hot a non-chromed barrel should remain serviceable for a long time.
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Re: EAA Zastava P.A.P. 7.62x39
« Reply #16 on: November 11, 2011, 03:02:42 PM »
The only thing about Yugo guns that I find noteworthy is that they typically lack chromed bores.

That and they are not necessarily interchangeable with other AKs.

Book, chromed bores are a standard feature on every other AK, and they help against corrosion.  For some reason the Yugos did not chrome line their SKSs as well.

Quote
Regarding 7.62xx, I have no horse in the race regarding 39 vs 54

You mean you don't have any preference towards either 7.62x39 or 5.45x39, right?  Good old' 7.62x54R isn't an assault rifle cartridge, and the two I just mentioned are the main ones.  Of course, there are also .223 variants now.

May be straying a bit off topic, but this is regarding the milled versus stamped AK receiver. When I read The Gun by CJ Chivers (recommended by the way), Chivers claimed the original design called for a stamped receiver. The Russians had a hard time actually producing the stamped recivers, so they substituted a milled receiver. Later on, whatever issues the Russians had, they figured out and the result was the AKM. Maybe this is common knowledge, but it was news to me.

Rob


Yup yup, Type 1 AKs are stamped, but then they started producing Types 2 & 3s in the 50s since it was actually easier to mill them; then I think it was 1959, they finally started working on the Type 4 stamped receivers.  As an aside, I want to add that Kalashnikov's original rifle was pretty neat in that it actually had features we would see on a western rifle, like a safety/selector by the pistol grip.  (I think I saw this on some Russian program on Youtube).  I want to say it also had an upper and lower portion as well.

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booksmart

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Re: EAA Zastava P.A.P. 7.62x39
« Reply #17 on: November 12, 2011, 10:57:25 AM »
I wouldn't bother with it.

For less money you could have an uncoverted Saiga. Then get you a better quality base gun and without the angle cut receiver, so if you ever decided to come to your senses and turn it into what it's meant to be (standard AK mags, pistol grip, etc) the process would be pretty straightforward.  ;D

http://www.jgsales.com/saiga-7.62x39-sporter-rifle,-tgi-import,-new.-p-5888.html


http://www.cross-conn.com/Saiga_Conversion/

Like so?

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Re: EAA Zastava P.A.P. 7.62x39
« Reply #18 on: November 12, 2011, 11:35:14 AM »
Exactly.
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Re: EAA Zastava P.A.P. 7.62x39
« Reply #19 on: November 13, 2011, 12:09:52 PM »
Because the RPK receiver is more stout, the gun is more rigid and stable... reliability wise it probably means nothing but RPK based guns do tend to be more accurate.
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Re: EAA Zastava P.A.P. 7.62x39
« Reply #20 on: November 23, 2011, 04:17:13 AM »
Eh, I think if I were looking to get a crippled RPK, I'd want a VEPR. At least it's Russian and chromed.

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Re: EAA Zastava P.A.P. 7.62x39
« Reply #21 on: November 29, 2011, 12:40:02 PM »
Quote
I think if I were looking to get a crippled RPK, I'd want a VEPR. At least it's Russian and chromed
Unless something has changed drastically while I wasn't looking, good luck finding them. :)

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Re: EAA Zastava P.A.P. 7.62x39
« Reply #22 on: November 29, 2011, 01:35:13 PM »
Unless something has changed drastically while I wasn't looking, good luck finding them. :)


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Re: EAA Zastava P.A.P. 7.62x39
« Reply #24 on: November 30, 2011, 08:45:29 PM »
LMO had a bunch of 7.62x39 VEPR's in when I was there about three weeks ago. Looked used. At least I think they were VEPR's. They were Russian and 7.62x39. Im not an AK fan, and that place makes your head hurt just looking around. They don't have a big store, but its a VERY cool store, and if you have limited time, you don't spend much of it checking out stuff that doesn't interest you. Web sight doesn't list any AK's, but it doesn't look like it has been up-dated lately.
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