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Author Topic: 4.6x30 HK  (Read 6288 times)

Tom The Impaler

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4.6x30 HK
« on: January 02, 2009, 12:57:08 PM »
Cool! I can now get 4.6X30 HK from two or three suppliers now (Midway and Cheaper Then Dirt Anyway).

Of course I can't get a gun to shoot them in cause I suck and HK hates me but I can get a couple of boxes of Fiocchi and stare at them!

http://www.midwayusa.com/browse/BrowseProducts.aspx?pageNum=1&tabId=3&categoryId=20217&categoryString=653***691***

I desperately await a weapon to shoot them through. :bowdown
Some people call the midwest the heartland, I prefer to think of it as the liver. Not too interesting, and easy to ignore until it quits working.


Mutant Musket

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Re: 4.6x30 HK
« Reply #1 on: January 02, 2009, 01:56:15 PM »
I want to make goo-goo eyes at that idiot new 5.56x30 pdw round.
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Deer Hunter

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Re: 4.6x30 HK
« Reply #2 on: January 02, 2009, 04:48:06 PM »
Neat.  A round that does nothing that the 5.7x28 wont do, which in turn wont do anything that a 7.62x25mm wont do. 
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HArry Buttermint

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Re: 4.6x30 HK
« Reply #3 on: January 02, 2009, 08:24:01 PM »
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« Last Edit: March 02, 2009, 05:14:54 PM by Harry Buttermint »

Penguin

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Re: 4.6x30 HK
« Reply #4 on: January 02, 2009, 09:19:17 PM »
I must admit I never heard of this round before. What gun shoots it? I guess it doens't much matter if it is an HK product though.
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JesseL

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Re: 4.6x30 HK
« Reply #5 on: January 02, 2009, 09:31:53 PM »
It's the round developed for the H&K MP7.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heckler_&_Koch_MP7

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Re: 4.6x30 HK
« Reply #6 on: January 02, 2009, 10:03:39 PM »
Meh, the H&K 4.6x30 is just a centerfire 17HMR with a fmj projectile....
That's what I was thinking...   "Ah, HK made the .17 Rem Fireball all Tacti-Cool."
I'll pass.
While I like the 5.7x28 and think it has good potential as a cartridge for hunting for fur pelts... I think these and other such cartridges are useless for life and death purposes.
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Tom The Impaler

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Re: 4.6x30 HK
« Reply #7 on: January 03, 2009, 11:06:48 AM »
That's what I was thinking...   "Ah, HK made the .17 Rem Fireball all Tacti-Cool."
I'll pass.
While I like the 5.7x28 and think it has good potential as a cartridge for hunting for fur pelts... I think these and other such cartridges are useless for life and death purposes.


I would disagree, but I'm not really a pro either. I think it's really easy to drop repeated hits accurately on target, head shots at 50 yards, torsos out to 200. It ain't a 223 and certainly not a .308 but reportedly it beats (in the P 90) the 9mm +P, and just name for me another SMG that can really hit at 200 yards.
Some people call the midwest the heartland, I prefer to think of it as the liver. Not too interesting, and easy to ignore until it quits working.

LittleLebowski

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Re: 4.6x30 HK
« Reply #8 on: January 03, 2009, 11:10:02 AM »
  A 10.5" 5.56 sounds so much better.  Or a 9mm hi cap pistol.  I don't need a round that I have shoot someone 10 times in the head with.

Tom The Impaler

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Re: 4.6x30 HK
« Reply #9 on: January 03, 2009, 11:11:53 AM »
What I really wonder is if Fiocchi is trying to unload a backlog of this stillborn cartridge before HK ends it's day-late-dollar-short PDW project.
Some people call the midwest the heartland, I prefer to think of it as the liver. Not too interesting, and easy to ignore until it quits working.

Doug Wojtowicz

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Re: 4.6x30 HK
« Reply #10 on: January 03, 2009, 01:05:44 PM »
I'd really like to see the MP7 in 9mm, or even 7.62x25 or 7.63 Mauser.
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HArry Buttermint

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Re: 4.6x30 HK
« Reply #11 on: January 03, 2009, 01:10:01 PM »
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« Last Edit: March 02, 2009, 05:12:13 PM by Harry Buttermint »

Doug Wojtowicz

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Re: 4.6x30 HK
« Reply #12 on: January 03, 2009, 02:20:44 PM »
That's exactly what I was thinking, only to add .357 sig to the mix.

.357 SIG MP7?

That would rule.
After a shooting spree, they want to take the guns away from everyone who didn't do it.

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GeorgeHill

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Re: 4.6x30 HK
« Reply #13 on: January 03, 2009, 03:24:59 PM »
Quote
I think it's really easy to drop repeated hits accurately on target, head shots at 50 yards, torsos out to 200.

I'll take it in 9mm.  147 grain HST loads would work just fine. 
And head shots at 50?  Are you kidding?   Fine in training.  In actual combat when rounds are flying both ways - doesn't happen very often.
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Re: 4.6x30 HK
« Reply #14 on: January 03, 2009, 03:28:41 PM »
Wow, just for the record, you aint aiming at the head during combat.  This isn't Halo.  In combat the targets are taking cover and trying not to get him themselves.  You're lucky to get any hit and it would be better to have a round that can do some damage when it does.
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Doug Wojtowicz

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Re: 4.6x30 HK
« Reply #15 on: January 03, 2009, 03:31:07 PM »
I'll take it in 9mm.  147 grain HST loads would work just fine. 
And head shots at 50?  Fine in training.  In actual combat when rounds are flying both ways - doesn't happen very often.


If you're trying to make a head shot at 50 with rounds going both ways, your tactics suck.

Still, as a collapsing stock machine pistol with lots of points of stabilization, it should provide the accuracy to make hits when things are hectic.
After a shooting spree, they want to take the guns away from everyone who didn't do it.

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JesseL

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Re: 4.6x30 HK
« Reply #16 on: January 03, 2009, 03:58:22 PM »
I'd really like to see the MP7 in 9mm, or even 7.62x25 or 7.63 Mauser.

The MP7 is gas operated with a rotating bolt though. For all the lower pressure handgun rounds listed above you'd be better off with the MP5's roller delayed blowback system.

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Doug Wojtowicz

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Re: 4.6x30 HK
« Reply #17 on: January 03, 2009, 04:04:19 PM »
The MP7 is gas operated with a rotating bolt though. For all the lower pressure handgun rounds listed above you'd be better off with the MP5's roller delayed blowback system.

Which means you get a fat beastie like the MP-5K which is why the MP7 layout is much more appealing.
After a shooting spree, they want to take the guns away from everyone who didn't do it.

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JesseL

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Re: 4.6x30 HK
« Reply #18 on: January 03, 2009, 04:12:01 PM »
Which means you get a fat beastie like the MP-5K which is why the MP7 layout is much more appealing.

Sure, but your average handgun round doesn't make enough gas volume to reliably cycle a gas operated action. The expansion ratio is all wrong. If you want an SMG with the size and weight of an MP7 chambered for a round like 7.62x25, 9x19, .357 Sig, etc. and you want it to work, it won't look anything like an MP7 on the inside.
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Doug Wojtowicz

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Re: 4.6x30 HK
« Reply #19 on: January 03, 2009, 04:47:24 PM »
I wonder what a 4.3mm round necked UP would look like, in that case.

Larger caliber, heavier bullet, but still a stiff load in the case.
After a shooting spree, they want to take the guns away from everyone who didn't do it.

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Daniel Watters

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Re: 4.6x30 HK
« Reply #20 on: January 03, 2009, 04:52:43 PM »
FWIW:  According to publicly available award documentation, the US Navy has purchased at minimum nearly a quarter million dollars worth of 4.6x30mm ammunition over previous years.  Just last month, a certain HSLD Navy unit placed a public solicitation for 400 MP7A1 40rd magazines, with an option for 500 more.

HArry Buttermint

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Re: 4.6x30 HK
« Reply #21 on: January 03, 2009, 05:20:30 PM »
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« Last Edit: March 02, 2009, 05:10:44 PM by Harry Buttermint »

JesseL

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Re: 4.6x30 HK
« Reply #22 on: January 03, 2009, 05:31:27 PM »
Oh, don't know, the H&KP7 and Steyr GB worked quite well, certainly not the same gas op as the MP7 but a small, thin, gas operated pistol caliber PDW be done efficiently, especially with something on the order of .357Sig, 7.62x25mm, or 9x23 Win. produce over 40,000psi, whereas the 4.6 operates at over 50,000psi, but I'd say the 9mmP with it's approx 35,000psi would perhaps be the least acceptable amount to make an efficient gas operated  PDW.
I like the concept of both the FN P90 and the MP7, I'm just not too sure of the rounds...Incidently, the 5.7 round has a pressure of approx 50,000 and the P90 is straight blowback....man, that's a lot of pressure in a blowback.....
After all of my long winded explaination saying it could be done...The real questions are; 1.Is it worth the expense & trouble to R&D? 2. Why bother if it dosen't yield any real advantage?  

I hesitate to call a gas-delayed blowback system gas operated, but you're right - it certainly would seem to be a reasonable basis for a lightweight and simple subgun. The big problem would probably be heat buildup. P7s (and other gas delayed blowback guns) are notorious for getting hot in a hurry and that's just a low capacity semi auto pistol. A full auto gun with 30+ round magazines would need serious insulation and unusually heat tolerant materials.

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HArry Buttermint

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Re: 4.6x30 HK
« Reply #23 on: January 03, 2009, 05:36:29 PM »
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« Last Edit: March 02, 2009, 05:09:11 PM by Harry Buttermint »

Doug Wojtowicz

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Re: 4.6x30 HK
« Reply #24 on: January 03, 2009, 10:22:20 PM »
Yep, your'e dead on. I've my trigger got uncomfortable once when firing on of the older PSP type P7s. It just goes back to: "Why bother?"

With the P7M's heat shield, you've got a super flat Single Action Only pistol that'll confuse any unauthorized, untrained users if you stumble down a flight of stairs and lose it.

Basically, I just like the squeeze-cock plus 4 pound trigger same as I like Browning pattern or decocker pattern or striker fired.  Each has its place for different people.
After a shooting spree, they want to take the guns away from everyone who didn't do it.

-William Burroughs


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