Help support WeTheArmed.com by visiting our sponsors.

Author Topic: +P .44 special loads/powders questions.  (Read 6994 times)

Grant

  • Senior Contributor
  • *****
  • Posts: 7854

  • Offline
+P .44 special loads/powders questions.
« on: January 10, 2015, 07:33:37 PM »
   Okay, I have a Super Blackhawk .44 mag.  I plan on getting a Redhawk in the semi-near future.

I been just shooting factory loads, I got a metric s___-ton of HSM ammo in .44 special and .44 mag for dirt cheap and I been shooting them to get the brass.

  My plans are to load pretty hot/standard 240s in my .44 mag cases and then load up some 200 grain JHP's into my .44 special cases really hopped up, for carry or a bit milder shooting.     That way it's a bit easier to keep separate on what "level" the loads are.   

I ask because....this will sound strange....I don't know a single person who hasn't used 2400 powder in their .44 mag or special.....as in.....I've asked over a dozen people and that's all I've gotten in response.   

And dad has some, I won't barge into his supply, so I need an alternate powder.  There hasn't been a can of 2400 around here for almost two years.


Also, I figured someone here has probably hot-loaded the .44 special  ;)   


Was wondering if anyone here had a good +P or +P+ (type, I know it isn't an industry standard) .44 special load, and had a .44 mag/special powder they liked other than 2400?

Montana"I’d say the worst part of all this is the feeling of betrayal,           but I’m betting the part where they break in here and beat us to death might be worse.”

WeTheArmed.com

  • Advertisement
  • ***

    mattitude

    • annoying a-hole
    • Contributor
    • ****
    • Posts: 1843
    • 100% disabled veteran
      • Ramblings of a Disabled Veteran

    • Offline
    Re: +P .44 special loads/powders questions.
    « Reply #1 on: January 10, 2015, 07:47:49 PM »
    I've used W296, H110, AA #9, Unique & Blue Dot in .44 rounds with very good results.  BTW a great resource for load data is from Hodgdon  http://www.hodgdonreloading.com/
    North CarolinaMedically retired Air Force (17 years, 7 months & 25 days)

    THE NORSEMAN

    • To preserve liberty, it is essential that the whole body of the people always possess arms, and be taught alike, especially when young, how to use them. - Richard Henry Lee
    • Moderator
    • Senior Contributor
    • *****
    • Posts: 5071

    • Offline
    Re: +P .44 special loads/powders questions.
    « Reply #2 on: January 12, 2015, 10:39:42 AM »
    You want 44 special +p stuff, eh?

    AA5, universal clays, HS6, or blue dot will all work well.

    With that said-  There may well be a very good reason "everybody" uses 2400....... :hmm ;)
    This may be considered as the true palladium of liberty. . . . The right of self defence is the first law of nature: in most governments it has been the study of rulers to confine this right within the narrowest limits possible. Wherever standing armies are kept up, and the right of the people to keep and bear arms is, under any colour or pretext whatsoever, prohibited, liberty, if not already annihilated, is on the brink of destruction- St. George Tucker, Blackstone's Commentaries

    Grant

    • Senior Contributor
    • *****
    • Posts: 7854

    • Offline
    Re: +P .44 special loads/powders questions.
    « Reply #3 on: January 12, 2015, 12:15:03 PM »
      If I can find 2400 I am snagging a big batch of it.   My tastes have been changing and leaning more towards revolvers...and if I'm going revolver....may as well go .44 mag  :cool

       Appreciate the advice, I'll find a few cans somewhere and pick them up.

    Montana"I’d say the worst part of all this is the feeling of betrayal,           but I’m betting the part where they break in here and beat us to death might be worse.”

    only1asterisk

    • Just some guy, you know?
    • Senior Contributor
    • *****
    • Posts: 2389

    • Offline
    Re: +P .44 special loads/powders questions.
    « Reply #4 on: January 12, 2015, 09:51:42 PM »
    You can add Unique and Hodgdon's Longshot to the list.

    The 44 Special Speer Gold Dot has great performance so long as you don't push it too hard.

    Grant

    • Senior Contributor
    • *****
    • Posts: 7854

    • Offline
    Re: +P .44 special loads/powders questions.
    « Reply #5 on: January 12, 2015, 10:22:10 PM »
      I'm wanting to load two setups:

    .44 Mag with 240 grain XTP's going about 1400FPS.

    .44 special +P's with 200 grain bullets going about 1200FPS. Good hitting power, yet still controllable and not too overboard.   

    Take a little work but try and find a pair of loads that shoot somewhat close/manageably close together.
    Montana"I’d say the worst part of all this is the feeling of betrayal,           but I’m betting the part where they break in here and beat us to death might be worse.”

    THE NORSEMAN

    • To preserve liberty, it is essential that the whole body of the people always possess arms, and be taught alike, especially when young, how to use them. - Richard Henry Lee
    • Moderator
    • Senior Contributor
    • *****
    • Posts: 5071

    • Offline
    Re: +P .44 special loads/powders questions.
    « Reply #6 on: January 14, 2015, 07:04:28 PM »
    Kinda on the spendy end, but if you're talking jacketed bullet loads in both cases?

    If you want set-it-and-forget-it super accurate and super clean loads?

    Use Vit N110 under the 240s in 44 mag.

    Use Vit N350 under the 200s in the 44 special.
    This may be considered as the true palladium of liberty. . . . The right of self defence is the first law of nature: in most governments it has been the study of rulers to confine this right within the narrowest limits possible. Wherever standing armies are kept up, and the right of the people to keep and bear arms is, under any colour or pretext whatsoever, prohibited, liberty, if not already annihilated, is on the brink of destruction- St. George Tucker, Blackstone's Commentaries

    Grant

    • Senior Contributor
    • *****
    • Posts: 7854

    • Offline
    Re: +P .44 special loads/powders questions.
    « Reply #7 on: January 14, 2015, 07:49:29 PM »
       Hmm...never tried Vit powder before.   In fact I've never seen any around here.  The gunstores just recently decided .30-30's weren't newtech (okay I exaggerate but not by much).    Super-clean and super-accurate work for me!

        Gives me stuff to look over.   I'm loading jacketed bullets only, because switching between cast/jacketed,etc. makes for different POI and I'd like to minimize the differences.         And it ain't like I'm going to go pop off 200 rounds of .44 in one range session.

     
    Montana"I’d say the worst part of all this is the feeling of betrayal,           but I’m betting the part where they break in here and beat us to death might be worse.”

    Mikee5star

    • Contributor
    • ****
    • Posts: 1643

    • Offline
    Re: +P .44 special loads/powders questions.
    « Reply #8 on: January 14, 2015, 08:14:14 PM »
    If you ever want to get rid of some .44 Spc brass....

    Fair warning, I am too cheap to buy new brass...
    Alaska

    Grant

    • Senior Contributor
    • *****
    • Posts: 7854

    • Offline
    Re: +P .44 special loads/powders questions.
    « Reply #9 on: January 14, 2015, 08:21:59 PM »
      I'll keep you in mind  ;)   I'd almost as soon have .44 mag brass, but it'd be a bit easier to keep loads separate this way.   I wonder about the special brass holding up to hot-hot loads but I don't think it'll be too bad.

     
    Montana"I’d say the worst part of all this is the feeling of betrayal,           but I’m betting the part where they break in here and beat us to death might be worse.”

    Mikee5star

    • Contributor
    • ****
    • Posts: 1643

    • Offline
    Re: +P .44 special loads/powders questions.
    « Reply #10 on: January 14, 2015, 11:32:17 PM »
    Might have to look at my brass stash in the spring and see if you want to trade some special for mag.  I know that I have enough .44 mag brass right now, here, what I can't remember is what I have in my other storage stashes.  Hopefully I can find pistol powder and reasonably priced primers again.
    Alaska

    Grant

    • Senior Contributor
    • *****
    • Posts: 7854

    • Offline
    Re: +P .44 special loads/powders questions.
    « Reply #11 on: January 14, 2015, 11:35:45 PM »
      if you don't mind me being nosy, what .44 mag do you have? 
    Montana"I’d say the worst part of all this is the feeling of betrayal,           but I’m betting the part where they break in here and beat us to death might be worse.”

    Mikee5star

    • Contributor
    • ****
    • Posts: 1643

    • Offline
    Re: +P .44 special loads/powders questions.
    « Reply #12 on: January 14, 2015, 11:53:08 PM »
      if you don't mind me being nosy, what .44 mag do you have? 

    S&W 629 5"  I have never seen a 29 with a 5" barrel.  I saw this one and grabbed it.  I think around 5" is the perfect barrel length on a handgun for me.  I have shot my buddy's SRH with the 7.5" barrel quite a bit as well. 
    Alaska

    Mikee5star

    • Contributor
    • ****
    • Posts: 1643

    • Offline
    Re: +P .44 special loads/powders questions.
    « Reply #13 on: January 15, 2015, 12:03:28 AM »
    I have been loading a little hot for it lately.  Getting a bit of primer flattening, so need to back off.  I am loading my home cast bullets with home brewed lead and my weights are a little off, so finding good data is hard.  I need a chronograph to find out how fast I am pushing them.

    That said they feel like the 300gr Alaskan Backer loads.  Even with the factory Houge's they smack.
    Alaska

    Mikee5star

    • Contributor
    • ****
    • Posts: 1643

    • Offline
    Re: +P .44 special loads/powders questions.
    « Reply #14 on: January 15, 2015, 12:04:16 AM »
    I have been loading a little hot for it lately.  Getting a bit of primer flattening, so need to back off.  I am loading my home cast bullets with home brewed lead and my weights are a little off, so finding good data is hard.  I need a chronograph to find out how fast I am pushing them.

    That said they feel like the 300gr Alaskan Backpackerer loads.  Even with the factory Houge's they smack.
    Alaska

    Mikee5star

    • Contributor
    • ****
    • Posts: 1643

    • Offline
    Re: +P .44 special loads/powders questions.
    « Reply #15 on: January 15, 2015, 12:07:33 AM »
    Okay I guess I am to tired to type.  Tried to modify for spelling and quoted. 

    I might try a Redhawk if I can find one with a decent trigger pull.  I have hated the trigger pull on all the SRH's I have tried.
    Alaska

    Grant

    • Senior Contributor
    • *****
    • Posts: 7854

    • Offline
    Re: +P .44 special loads/powders questions.
    « Reply #16 on: January 15, 2015, 08:21:30 AM »
      I'm torn on getting a 5.5" or 7.5" Redhawk.     I have a 7.5" super Blackhawk that I love, so I thought of getting a 5.5" Redhawk, but the long barrels on .44 mags just make them point so much handier.

    That said....it's a real pain to find a blued Redhawk in anything, and I'm not finding them at "decent" prices.
    Montana"I’d say the worst part of all this is the feeling of betrayal,           but I’m betting the part where they break in here and beat us to death might be worse.”

    Mikee5star

    • Contributor
    • ****
    • Posts: 1643

    • Offline
    Re: +P .44 special loads/powders questions.
    « Reply #17 on: January 15, 2015, 01:04:22 PM »
      I'm torn on getting a 5.5" or 7.5" Redhawk.     I have a 7.5" super Blackhawk that I love, so I thought of getting a 5.5" Redhawk, but the long barrels on .44 mags just make them point so much handier.

    That said....it's a real pain to find a blued Redhawk in anything, and I'm not finding them at "decent" prices.

    I have been seeing a few lately, but mostly with the 4" barrel.  I am curious about how much lighter a 7.5" Redhawk is over the SRH with the same barrel length.
    Alaska

    Grant

    • Senior Contributor
    • *****
    • Posts: 7854

    • Offline
    Re: +P .44 special loads/powders questions.
    « Reply #18 on: August 27, 2015, 02:10:18 AM »
      Just thought I'd update:

      No 2400 around, I did manage to pick up two cans of H110.    However there has been endless cans of IMR 4227 around so I decided to try it.

    Downside is it's all roughly 3-4 dollars a pound more expensive than anything else.    Plus side is I can reliably stock it up and not have to be switching powders all the time (I'm slightly OCD about having even counts and types of brass and specific loads rather than 20 of this, 30 of that,etc.).

      It does seem to be pretty accurate, if it isn't the most powerful, and seems consistant when it comes to loading.

       
    Montana"I’d say the worst part of all this is the feeling of betrayal,           but I’m betting the part where they break in here and beat us to death might be worse.”

    Grant

    • Senior Contributor
    • *****
    • Posts: 7854

    • Offline
    Re: +P .44 special loads/powders questions.
    « Reply #19 on: August 29, 2015, 12:53:19 PM »
       Okay.......I'll admit....I'm "somewhat" enjoying loading for the .44.....my previous experiances were with stuff like the 7mm Mag,etc.  bit more involved....got a set of carbide dies for the .44.

    And with me and 2 friends doing it we've got our own mini assembly line we can crank out cartridges.

       So far what I've loaded (accuracy shot and chronographed  :cool)

      240 XTP with 24.5 grains of 4227.   averaged velocity of 1370 and was around 2.5" at 25 yards.

      200 XTP with 27.5 grains of 4227 was 1486FPS and all shots touched at 25 yards (that load was SUPER accurate and pretty controllable).
     
      240 hardcast.  Lack of powder around I tried Accurate Number 5, 9.5 grains.  960FPS and about 2" at 25 yards.     

        That last load is making me want a .44 special Ruger flat top  :cool   
    Montana"I’d say the worst part of all this is the feeling of betrayal,           but I’m betting the part where they break in here and beat us to death might be worse.”

    Mikee5star

    • Contributor
    • ****
    • Posts: 1643

    • Offline
    Re: +P .44 special loads/powders questions.
    « Reply #20 on: August 29, 2015, 05:36:34 PM »
    .44 specials versatility is the why I have a hankering for a ultra light weight. And a long barrel target version. I will trade my 5" 629, and my G 20 for these down the road, when I have time.
    Alaska

    coelacanth

    • Senior Contributor
    • *****
    • Posts: 7258
    • eccentric orbit

    • Offline
    Re: +P .44 special loads/powders questions.
    « Reply #21 on: August 29, 2015, 11:23:57 PM »
    I REALLY wish Ruger would come out with a 5 shot GP 100 in .44 special.  I'd be on that like white on rice.  I know I can get one built by Clement's Custom Guns but if Ruger does it, I don't have to add a trainload of money to the price of the gun and then wait for a year and a half for delivery. 
    Arizona"A dying culture invariably exhibits personal rudeness.  Bad manners.  Lack of consideration for others in minor matters.  A loss of politeness, of gentle manners, is more significant than is a riot."
                          Robert A. Heinlein ,   Friday

    Grant

    • Senior Contributor
    • *****
    • Posts: 7854

    • Offline
    Re: +P .44 special loads/powders questions.
    « Reply #22 on: August 30, 2015, 09:19:15 AM »
      I have always had a lot of respect for the .44 special, especially in guns that can handle moderate uploading.   Power of a .357 without all the blast and noise.

     
       
    Montana"I’d say the worst part of all this is the feeling of betrayal,           but I’m betting the part where they break in here and beat us to death might be worse.”

    THE NORSEMAN

    • To preserve liberty, it is essential that the whole body of the people always possess arms, and be taught alike, especially when young, how to use them. - Richard Henry Lee
    • Moderator
    • Senior Contributor
    • *****
    • Posts: 5071

    • Offline
    Re: +P .44 special loads/powders questions.
    « Reply #23 on: September 21, 2015, 01:54:53 AM »
    That H4227 will be great for you in top end 44 special loads, and good in 44 magnum most of the way.  Good powder to have on hand if you can get it consistently.
    This may be considered as the true palladium of liberty. . . . The right of self defence is the first law of nature: in most governments it has been the study of rulers to confine this right within the narrowest limits possible. Wherever standing armies are kept up, and the right of the people to keep and bear arms is, under any colour or pretext whatsoever, prohibited, liberty, if not already annihilated, is on the brink of destruction- St. George Tucker, Blackstone's Commentaries

    Grant

    • Senior Contributor
    • *****
    • Posts: 7854

    • Offline
    Re: +P .44 special loads/powders questions.
    « Reply #24 on: October 29, 2015, 07:13:44 PM »
      Okay, update and a question for people who have actually reloaded a lot.

      My new Redhawk.....shoots JHP bullets roughly 4" left of where my hardcasts hit, my Super Blackhawk clusters them all the same right<>left with just minor changes in elevation.

    (my loads, for reference)

    #1:.44 mag case, 240 XTP over 24.5 grains of IMR 4227    1370fps
    #2: .44 mag case, 200 XTP over 27.5 grains of IMR 4227    1480fps
    #3.  .44 special case 240 hardcast over 9.5 grains Accurate #5 960fps
    #4  .44 mag case, 240 hardcast over 11 grains of Accurate #5.  980fps

       I tried load #4, because I thought if I boosted velocity a shade it might shift POI a hair.

      BUT.....Load #4 chronies about the same velocity as the Load #3.  With a fast-burning powder like #5, I thought it would be at least 100fps faster.

     My question:  all I could find is the .44 mag case has about 15% more capacity.  That enough to drop pressures to nearly the same velocity?


      Also....I don't want to lead up the barrel, but I want to tinker a bit and try to get the POI's nearly the same R<>L.  Elevation ain't a biggy. 

    ALL my other guns with specials in magnums, heavier, lighter,etc.  just change elevation, R<>L is unchanged.

    Montana"I’d say the worst part of all this is the feeling of betrayal,           but I’m betting the part where they break in here and beat us to death might be worse.”

    Help support WeTheArmed.com by visiting our sponsors.